How To: Mazda FS-DE Camshaft Installation

[twilightprotege]

Precautions
- Make sure the engine is cold (good idea to leave it sitting overnight)
- Give yourself a day to do the work
- Trust yourself. It is a relatively easy but very time consuming for the beginner and can become a little frustrating at times.
- This is just a guide. Do not blame me is you stuff up and your engine goes boom.

What you need
- Torque wrench
- Metric sockets (10mm, 12mm, 14mm, 17mm, 21mm)
- Impact wrench
- Engine oil
- Marker pen
- Friend
- Patience
- 1 Day to work on your car

1. Disconnect the negative battery terminal. This is just a safety step.
2. This step is just for those who have the plastic engine cover on their engine (me). Unbolt the nuts on your plastic cover. You’ll need a 10mm socket for this. See picture below
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 2.jpg
3. Remove the ignition coils. Unclip the wires from it then you’ll once again need a 10mm socket to take off the coils. Naturally, also remove the spark leads at the same time. See picture below. I recommend leaving the spark leads attached to the coil so you are putting the car back together exactly the same as it was before. Also remove the spark plugs.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 3.jpg
4. Unclip the wiring harness from the points in the picture below. There are actually two connectors at the bottom point and also a little zip-tie like thing to the right of it. Once that wiring harness is not connected to anything, put it out of the way on top of the intake manifold.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 4.jpg
5. In the middle of the head cover there is a little pipe that needs to be pulled out. Once you have that out, your engine bay should look like the picture below.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 5.jpg
6. Now we start to really get into business. Remove the bolts on the head cover in the order numbered in the picture below. You’ll need a 10mm socket for this. Remove each bolt a few turns at a time. At point 7, remove the bolt you can’t quite see in the picture. The one you can see (one top of the engine cover does nothing. It’s only there for the spark leads.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 6.jpg
7. Once you have all the bolts out. Remove the head cover. The below picture is what you should see.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 7.jpg
8. Remove the top timing belt cover. I didn’t take a picture of this, but there are 4 bolts you need to take out, 2 on each side. 10mm socket is required here. Once you have undone the bolts and have them out, just remove the plastic cover.
9. Remove the number 3 engine mount. Don’t worry, the other 3 engine mounts are enough to hold the engine just fine – just don’t leave your car like this for months. The nuts on the engine are 17mm and the nuts and bolts on the car are 14mm. See picture below. The circle with only pipes underneath it – there is a bolt under the pipes, you just can’t see it from the angle I took the picture at.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 9.jpg
10. Now the pain in the arse jobs begin. You need to remove the 2 drive belts. The outer one does the power steering oil pump and the air conditioning compressor. You remove this one first. In the below picture you loosen the no 1 bolt out about 5mm. That is a 12mm bolt. Next there are two bolts you need to loosen hidden under number 2. They are both 10mm bolts. If you are looking from this direction, you loosen 1 bolt on your right, 1 bolt right in front of you. These bolts are used for adjusting the tension of the drive belt. Once you have loosened these bolts enough, the drive belt should be able to come off.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 10.jpg
11. The inner belt is the alternator and water pump drive belt. It’s too cluttered down there so I didn’t take a picture, but it’s pretty much the same, but upside down as the power steering bolts. If you can imagine the above picture upside down, the places of the bolts are in the same place. And to make your life much easier to get to the adjusting bolts, now is a good time to put the car up on jacks, that’s what I did.
12. While you have your car up on jacks, turn the steering all the way to the right. That just allows easier access to the crankshaft pulley for later and allows you to take off the underneath plastic cover. There are 5 bolts I think, all 10mm, and 1 clip to the left of the driveshaft as you look at it from the side of the car.
13. In preparation for the next step, rotate the crank (I just used a socket and bar) so that the engine is a top dead centre. You may need a friend to help you align this otherwise you’ll be moving it 2mm then jumping up and checking the mark and so on. If you look down on top of the engine where the engine mount was, you can see the crankshaft pulley. On the engine side of the pulley you’ll see a little plastic marking thing showing out of it. It will have a 10 and a T plus a lot of straight up and down lines. This is the timing marks. To find top dead centre you rotate the crank around (clockwise) so that the yellow mark on the crank pulley is in line with the T. Once that is in line, check the cam pulleys. There is a mark on the intake cam sprocket, “I”, and this needs to be pointing towards the “E” mark on the exhaust cam sprocket. If they are not, rotate the crank pulley a further 360 degrees.
14. Next we need to remove the crankshaft pulley. The crankshaft pulley is right at the bottom of the engine and you can see the big bolt connecting it to the crank from the side of the car. I recommend hiring an impact wrench for the day as it’s so much easier and safer. The bolt is 21mm. Get a person to put the car into a gear and get them to apply the brakes. This will stop the engine moving when you use the wrench. With the wrench in place, get that sucker off. It may take a while, it may take a second, but bolt will eventually undo. This now allows you to remove the pulley. Before removing the pulley, make sure that the timing marks are still aligned. I found the pulley a little difficult to remove but if you put your hands behind it at either side and sort of wiggle it off it will eventually come off for you.
15. From here we need to remove the water pump pulley. An easy way to do this once again requires a friend. Using a clamp, connect that to the centre part of the water pump pulley. Get your friend to hold this. Get underneath the car and by using a 10mm socket, remove the 4 bolts holding it in place. Now take the pulley off.
16. Now we remove the lower plastic timing belt cover. Similar to the top one, 3 10mm bolts this time. It’s a little bit fiddly to take out, but it gets there.
17. This is just a safety step, it is not required. With a marker place a mark on both the timing belt and the cam sprocket, once again on the crank timing pulley and timing belt. This will just make sure that everything lines up when you go to reinstall the timing belt later on. And yes, the timing is very important.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 17.jpg
18. Now finally down to business. We need to remove the cam sprocket. I found this easiest to remove with the timing belt still in place. The bolt on the sprocket marked in the picture below is 14mm. Obviously you only do this one cam at a time. With a holding a spanner in place where I circled on the cam, loosen the cam sprocket bolt. At this stage do not remove the belt or the sprocket just yet. Next loosen the other cam sprocket bolt following the same procedure. Now we can remove the bolts and the timing belt and cam sprockets.
19. Now for the take your time part, removing the cams. Loosen the cam bolts a few turns at a time in the order marked on the picture below. These are 10mm bolts. Be very careful that the cam doesn’t apply too much pressure to one cam cap over the rest, so after the first few turns you can start to remove the bolts out of order to try and keep the cam straight. What I mean by that is if a bolt is loose, just leave that one be for a little while. You need to loosen the bolts that have a bit of pressure on them more. If you have set up the camshaft sprockets like I said earlier, number 3 cylinder (third from the cam sprocket) on the intake cam (closest the firewall) should be the one applying pressure via the valves. Number 2 cylinder (second from the cap sprocket) on the exhaust (closest the front of the car) should be the applying the pressure via the valves.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/step 19.jpg
20. Once you have undone the bolts, I suggest placing them somewhere intact and in order (ie bolts are still in the cam cap). This will ensure you are placing the engine back together as best as close as possible to before.
21. Remove the cams. Take off and clean the oil seal (black plastic ring) from each cam. Once again, make sure you know which one is for the intake and exhaust cam.

[twilightprotege]

Now we get into the fun part, putting your new cams back in.

22. First of all, using engine oil, thoroughly coat your new cams. Make sure every bit is covered, yes get your hands nice and dirty. Do the same to the cam oil seals (from step 21).
23. Line up your new cams along side the original ones and make sure you know which is going in the intake side and which is going in the exhaust side. This is most easily done by comparing the pins at the end.
24. Put the cam oil seal on each respective cam and place the intake cam on the intake side of the engine and the exhaust cam on the exhaust side of the engine. If you have followed my advise from above about timing, you need to place the lobe of the intake cam on the number 1 cylinder (closest the cam sprocket end) pointing away from the front of the car and the exhaust cam lobe on the number 1 cylinder points towards the front of the car. This should make the pins on both cams on top of the cam.
http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/twilightprotege/Step 24.jpg
25. Replace the cam caps and bolts and hand tighten them all up. Now tighten them all in the order shown a few turns at a time in the picture below. Before they bolts are too tight, make sure the cam oil seal is in place. They should be lining up with the edge of the cylinder head or just inside the cylinder head. These bolts then need to be tightened to 100-125 inch pounds of force (1.15-1.45 kg metre of force, 8.33-10.42 feet pounds of force). Just make sure you continue tightening the bolts in order.
26. Place the cam sprockets back into place. Make sure the intake cam sprocket points the “I” towards the exhaust cam and the exhaust cam sprocket points the “E” towards the intake cam, same as in step 13.
27. Put the respective bolt and washer in the cam to connect the sprocket, opposite to step 18. These bolts need to be tightened to 444-528 inch pounds of force (5.0-6.2 kg metre of force, 37 – 44 feet pounds of force).
28. Replace the timing belt. If you took my advice and marked on the cam sprocket and timing belt, line those marks up. Do the same to the crank timing belt pulley, but this is where it getting a little awkward. If you look from the top of the engine bay down, straight under the intake cam sprocket there is a little shiny pulley. This is what keeps the tightness in the timing belt. Just above the bolt that holds it in place there is an Allen key hole. Put the Allen key in and rotate the tensioner towards the rear of the car. This should then give you enough room to put the timing belt back into place. If the marks on the timing belts and the cam sprockets and crank timing pulley line up, let the tensioner go. Just to make sure, feel that the timing belt has no movement (a little is ok).
29. Rotate the engine around 720 degrees in a clockwise direction. I recommend doing this very slowly for the first time. This is to ensure the valves aren’t hitting the pistons and the lift on your cams isn’t too much. I found this easiest by placing the crank pulley bolt back in and using a socket to rotate the engine. If there was no problems, rotate the engine and align the cam sprockets up (I and E remember?).
30. Replace the lower timing belt plastic cover (opposite step 16).
31. Replace the crank pulley (opposite step 14). Hand tighten the bolt at first and check the timing marks again, same as in step 13. Once you are happy with the timing you can attack the bolt. This bolt needs to be on bloody tight – 1392-1464 inch pounds of force (16.0-17.0 kg metre of force, 116-122 feet pounds of force). If you’re lucky enough to have a torque wrench that goes that high in force use that. Otherwise do what I did, use the impact wrench and do the same as in step 14 except tighten the bold this time.
32. Replace the water pump pulley. Follow along the same lines as in step 15. Just make sure the bolts are nice and firm. There is no need to torque these bolts unless you really want to (most torque wrenches don’t go that low of force). The reason you do this after the crank pulley is because if you need to take off the plastic cover because the timing isn’t right, it’s not as much hassle.
33. Put the alternator and power steering drive belts back in, along the lines of steps 10 and 11.
34. While the car is still off the ground, replace the underneath plastic cover, along the lines of step12.
35. Put the number 3 engine mount back in, along the lines of step 9. The bolts connecting to the engine need to be torqued to 660-927 inch pounds of force (7.6-10.7 kg metre of force, 55-77.3 feet pound of force). The other 3 bolts and 1 nut need to be torqued to 528-708 inch pounds of force (6.0-8.2 kg metre of force, 44-59 feet pounds of force).
36. Replace the top timing belt plastic cover, along the lines of step 8.
37. Replace the head cover and hand tighten all the bolts for the cover. Tighten the bolts from there a few turns at a time. These bolts just need to be nice and firm.
38. Replace all the electrical wires, along the lines of step 4.
39. Replace the spark plugs then ignition coils and spark leads, along the lines of step 3.
40. If you have the plastic engine cover, replace this, along the lines of step 2
41. Reconnect the negative battery terminal.

Get in the car and turn the key to the run setting, but don’t turn the engine over just yet. Wait for the car to check the wires are all connected and happy. If there are no unusual warning lights (ie battery, oil pressure) then turn the engine over a bit at a time. DO NOT START THE CAR. This is just to turn the engine over to once again make sure everything is happy.

If you are satisfied with your work, start the car.

Mods, please move this to the how to section.
For those who have done this mod, please double check that I have explained this well enough.
Also, if anyone would like me to update this by adding more pictures etc, let me know because I'll be attempting to install my cams next weekend (long story as to why they arent in now)

[Matthew]

this is what im wondering...every mechanic that i have ever talked to said when you replace cams you should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS replace the cam bearings since the old ones will be worn to the old cams...why is that not done here

[FrigginGLI]

Yikes , this is not a job for rookies. :(

[Matthew]

thats what i was thinkin

[kidkorrupt]

holy crap, what an exhaustive how-to.

quick, somone move this into the how-to section before it gets pusehd down to the bottom in the performance section.

i need to read it later as i'm on dialup now and its killing me =P

[Matthew]

i think im still as lost as i was prior to this how-to...it seems to be very good, but im just too tech stupid.

[ahb11m]

as andrew said first off, ya have to trust yourself with it... and take ya time, the moment you start rushing anything, is when stuff goes wrong!! (just ask my petrol gauge it'll agree) the trick is to not get excited that your done and do something silly

[ahb11m]

probably best to print instead of try to remember!!1

[twilightprotege]

matthew - our car does not have cam bearings.

yes this is definately not a rookie job....but having said that - this is the first time i have ever change and internal part of any engine. it wasnt overly difficult to be honest, but it was just time consuming.

but please, if anyone has any questions about this just ask me.

[zmepro]

how much power did ya feel with your new cams?

[twilightprotege]

wasnt able to put them in. the cam pins i had were two small and also the cam pin on the exhaust side is 180degrees opposite the intake cam....i was sent both blank intake cams from mitch @ protege5online.com.

so at the moment it looks as if i wont be installing the cams until the weekend of 18-19 october....and that'll be head at the same time (i'm taking my head to get ported in the week starting 6 october). i just dont have time to put the cams in before i get the head work done so i figured i might as well wait.

[TheMAN]

I wouldn't trust the engine sitting itself on just the 3 engine mounts... since the front and rear ones are offset to be at the other side of the engine, near the tranny... rather you should have placed a block of wood over the floor jack and jack up the oil pan to keep the engine level... and since you have removed the #3 engine mount already, you might as well remove the timing belt to keep it clean from oil splashes, etc

and you forgot to put rtv in the cam bearings closest to the cam pulleys... you also forgot to mention that in order to reinstall the cam pulleys, you must use a wrench to hold the cam in place via the hex-shaped spot on the cam

btw... does your stock intake cam have a "FSD7", "FS1G" or "FSH9" casted on it?

[Matthew]

yes i do remember that section in the manual about the rtv.

edwin how about i buy the intake camshaft and you help me put it in after the next meet :)

[TheMAN]

send in the air force chopper to pick me up then
all expenses paid plus food :p

[twilightprotege]

yeah i forgot to write remove the timing belt. that's what i did.

with reinstalling the cam pulleys, that's why i referred to step 13...once again, could have written that better.

and you're going to have to slap me silly, but rtv? wtf?

theman, when you talk about bearings, what are you talking about? also, i dont know about the stock cams...but i can check when i next have them out....what's each stamp referring to? i assume one is the jspec, 1 is the early cam and the other is the later cam. i saw them stamped on it but didnt take any notice

[Matthew]

now someone told me we had cam bearings and someone said we didnt.

Twilight - RTV is a sticky compound/grease that smells really bad. it comes in different colors so i cant describe it that way.

[RAAZ227]

When I did both intake and exhaust cams I didn't find it neccesary to remove all the other belts or the mount. I didn't remove the timing belt either, or the crank pulley. We removed the cam gear cover, lossened up the tensioner slid the belt right off. Making sure it was at TDC. Then we slid the belt right back on. So I guess there are a couple was of doing it.

Nice How to. Well done :D

[RAAZ227]

Originally posted by Matthew
now someone told me we had cam bearings and someone said we didnt.

Twilight - RTV is a sticky compound/grease that smells really bad. it comes in different colors so i cant describe it that way.


Do you mean cam seals?? I know we have them.

[Matthew]

no, cam BEARINGS

[mrpopnfresh]

Hey guys, I just installed my cams and Cam gears in this weekend and was going to do a how-to but twilight beat me to it. I have no mechanical skills and this was the first time I've ever done it and it was easy as hell!! I could do this all day blindfolded now!!

Basically the only thing you have to watch out for is your timing! If everything is not at TDC you're screwed!! (at least I am at the moment!)

You could get RVT sealant at any Kragen, Pep Boys, Autozone...etc. and it would help to pick up some assembly lube.

Another caution, the bolts holding the cam gears in are tight! If you're by yourself (like I was) then just use a cresent wrench to hold the cam, and a socket to hold the bolt on the cam gear. Put a pole between them (like the one on your car jack) and use them as leverage against eachother.

Also, when installing the gears, put the exaust gear on first and tighten it down. Then grab the timing belt and pull it up until there is no more slack. Bring the slack over to the intake side and make sure everything is aligned!! To get the intake cam gear in, simply put the bolt through the cam gear hole, and into the cam. As you tighten the bolt, it will force the cam gear into place. Don't worry about stripping the bolt because it won't happen!!

Make sure to oil everything up and that's it.

[TheMAN]

somebody didn't read the FSM....
http://www.permatex.com/products/industrial_individual_products2.asp?selectid=2&category=gasketing&oe_category=gasketing&product=Permatex,%20Ultra%20Grey,%20Gasket%20Maker
gray is the ONLY one that should be used on our cars EVER

find out for me what code is casted on your stock intake cam... I have a feeling you'll be surprised...


Originally posted by twilightprotege
yeah i forgot to write remove the timing belt. that's what i did.

with reinstalling the cam pulleys, that's why i referred to step 13...once again, could have written that better.

and you're going to have to slap me silly, but rtv? wtf?

theman, when you talk about bearings, what are you talking about? also, i dont know about the stock cams...but i can check when i next have them out....what's each stamp referring to? i assume one is the jspec, 1 is the early cam and the other is the later cam. i saw them stamped on it but didnt take any notice

[twilightprotege]

arh that's what rtv....i see said the blind man. the manual refers to it as silicone sealant. because i didnt actually change the cams and i'll be doing that again in a few weeks i didnt worry about it this time.

and our cars definately do not have cam bearings.

raaz227, i first of all tried without removing all the belts, but then decided to remove them, just to make life that little easier. and yeah, there are definately other ways to do this

theman, so what does do the codes you said refer to? ie is the fsd7 j-spec etc...

and just for people reading this thread for the first time, mrpopnfresh reitterates the most important point....
Basically the only thing you have to watch out for is your timing! If everything is not at TDC you're screwed!!

[MikeBlueP5]

my stock intake is a FS1G and the exhaust is a FSD7
I cant remember what the new intake was, and the exhaust had been ground from a blank im guessing, the cast number had been removed.

[Minus]

damn i have no idea what anyone is talking about anymore..... this looks way to complicated for 10 horsepower.... maybe if i could get an experienced friend to help me, it would be better

[twilightprotege]

i have to admit it's a pretty long process, but isnt overly difficult if you take your time and make sure everything is done right the first time. like i said early, this was actually the first major engine work i have done myself and i had no problem. but if you dont feel confident enough, get a friend to help.

i'll be taking a few more pictures next weekend as i once again remove the cams....and head and intake manifold (for porting)

theman, as soon as i take the cams out, i'll let you know what code is casted on the cams...

[fluxMP3]

im gettin my cams in the mail tommorow..i jus ordered them .there mazdaspeed intake and exhaust cams. ill try to follow what you wrote on the how-to but ill e-mail ya if i get stuck....i got em @... srmotorsports.com....mostly a mazda site..its pretty tight ..they got a good price for engine parts check them out ...

[twilightprotege]

yeah no worries...just pop me an email if required.

i'll be taking my cams out again this weekend (sunday) so i'l try to take more pics...but this time i'm also taking out the head and intake manifold to get ported...will add an additional how-to for the head and intake manifold removal

[ahb11m]

twilight... so your using the long weekend to work on the car right?

[twilightprotege]

long weekend...unfortunately not here in queensland. i'm going to be rushing it actually...my mum is going to italy on sunday at 3pm, when i get back that's when the head and everything is coming off...

[twilightprotege]

TheMAN - the cams I have :

Intake : FSH9
Exhaust : FSD7

what are they?????

[TheMAN]

that's what I thought you had... so now, here it is...

OEM solid lifter cams
intake FSH9 = J-spec/E-spec FS "high power" intake cam
exhaust FSD7 = HP biased cam

intake FS1G = US-spec mild/midrange cam modified to be emissions friendly
intake FSD7 = mild/midrange cam

intake/exhaust FS1E = torque biased cam (from J-spec/E-spec 99-00 MPV)



OEM HLA lifter cams
intake/exhaust FS01 (exhaust cam has distributor gear)



and you thought an FS-DE is an FS-DE huh? ;)

[twilightprotege]

very cool :D

so who wants to buy my original cams????????

[twilightprotege]

ppl my cams are for sale - http://www.msprotege.com/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33899

[YuYuRena]

Guys engines are not hard to work with, just take your time and be logical. If the parts doesn't fit, it doesn't work. Me along with 4 other kids were able to fully dissemble a Ford SVT Cobra V8 engine and put it back together, only using an engine diagram from Ford. It just take time and the right tool anybody can do it. And man looking at our engine compared to that big V8, ours is tiny. hehe

[MikeBlueP5]

a v8 cobra engine is about the easiest engine to disassemble/assemble i have ever seen. I know this due to the fact that i worked in a machine shop for 3 years. The 4.6/5.4 v8 engines are about as basic as a OHC engine gets

[EmeraldMICA03]

this is true about the DOHC Cobra motor, and it would be even more easier if there was a little more room in between the strut mounts.

[MikeBlueP5]

hello old thread, lol. Yeah this is true. Although you think its a tight squeeze in the cobra, try the lightning engine in a ranger. Its been done by SVT, as well as a older SVT ranger they prototyped back in the mid-late 90s. It had a 5.0 HO and a explorer front end.

[EmeraldMICA03]

Which Lightning motor are you refering to? The 5.8 ohv or the 5.4 2v?

[twilightprotege]

pls keep this thread ON TOPIC (pissed)

[MikeBlueP5]

the s/c 5.4, the 351/5.8 wouldnt be a problem to get into a ranger as it is essentially the same size as a 302 on the outside. The only difference is its a little taller and a little wider. Hell you can even use 302 heads on a 351 you just have to drill the head bolt holes a little larger.

[Laser03pro]

So you can install cams and not have to do nething to the computer ??

[twilightprotege]

you certainly can...but resetting it is a minimum requirement.

swapping out to an aftermarket as always will give the greatest result...

[Laser03pro]

Not to be off topic but do u think bypassin the TB helped twilight. I know its pretty easy on camaro's but ill have to check it out.Would it hurt anything in the winter.

[twilightprotege]

i dont think it has done anything, but every little bit helps. it is easy to do. i wouldnt do it if in your area it gets below freezing in winter

[vielster]

So we don't have to adjust the lash or anything? They just pop in and that's it?

[twilightprotege]

they do just pop in if the base circle is the same as stock - ie 1.380".

but it is always wise to check

[MikeBlueP5]

correct, even with the same base circle you should always check the lash just to make sure its still within specs. I believe the manual calls for check/adjustment (via shims) evey 60k miles or so. I dont really remember without looking. I did check mine after my cam install. I might recheck them when i pull my valve cover to paint it. I would like to have .009" myself. I think most of mine were .010 or .011 when i checked them. not like .001" gonna really matter though, but itll help with noise.

[Rism]

When I did both intake and exhaust cams I didn't find it neccesary to remove all the other belts or the mount. I didn't remove the timing belt either, or the crank pulley. We removed the cam gear cover, lossened up the tensioner slid the belt right off. Making sure it was at TDC. Then we slid the belt right back on. So I guess there are a couple was of doing it.

Nice How to. Well done :D
Yea I dont really see why all that extra work is necessary to remove camshafts. Anyone care to explain?

[twilightprotege]

i found it just was easier. you dont need to take the belts off really, you can leave them hanging over the engine mounts (which is what i've done since), but it all depends on how good of a mechanic you are. the how-to i wrote is really a beginner's way of doing it.

although, i still think removing the crank pulley is the way to go otherwise you can never be 100% sure you have the crank and cam gears aligned - ie what if the belt isnt toothed up properly at the crank?

[MikeBlueP5]

yup twilight is right on that one. I thought i had everything lined up till i checked the crank pulley it was about 2 teeth off. Its always a good idea to take the cover off and make sure you get it all right on the first try than to have it off by two teeth and have to redo it. And any slack at all at the bottom of the belt will throw it off during reassembly unless you are watching it. I tried the easy way of just sliding it off and back on and as soon as i pulled it off the cam pulley the tensioner pulled the slack so i said F it ill do it the right way.

[Kansei]

yup twilight is right on that one. I thought i had everything lined up till i checked the crank pulley it was about 2 teeth off. Its always a good idea to take the cover off and make sure you get it all right on the first try than to have it off by two teeth and have to redo it. And any slack at all at the bottom of the belt will throw it off during reassembly unless you are watching it. I tried the easy way of just sliding it off and back on and as soon as i pulled it off the cam pulley the tensioner pulled the slack so i said F it ill do it the right way.

Argh.. spend 150 dollars on an electric impact wrench (I don't have an impact wrench with me at college) or try it without removing the crank pulley. hmm.

The other problem is I can't remove any of the wheels on my car because my wheel lock key is broken so I can't get anywhere near the crank pulley :(

Damnit I don't want to wait until thanksgiving break, I'll have to do it in the cold, laying in a gravel driveway instead of my heated garage in NY :(

[MikeBlueP5]

others have used another method described somewhere else in this thread. all you really need is to get the passenger wheel off, then you can use a long breaker bar and just hit the starter one time with the breaker bar on the ground it should break the bolt loose. I wouldnt reccomend this method. I would use an impact, might i add it needs to be a pretty strong one, or go buy the service tool from mazda. all it is is a tool with a hole in the middle and two that line up with it that bolt to the crank pulley, works kinda like a lever action. I tried to make one out of wood, but that didnt go over too well, i ended up paying 350$ for a compressor and air tools.

[Kansei]

others have used another method described somewhere else in this thread. all you really need is to get the passenger wheel off, then you can use a long breaker bar and just hit the starter one time with the breaker bar on the ground it should break the bolt loose. I wouldnt reccomend this method. I would use an impact, might i add it needs to be a pretty strong one, or go buy the service tool from mazda. all it is is a tool with a hole in the middle and two that line up with it that bolt to the crank pulley, works kinda like a lever action. I tried to make one out of wood, but that didnt go over too well, i ended up paying 350$ for a compressor and air tools.

When I installed my underdrive pulley I did it with an electric impact wrench, but I don't have access to that at school. Reading through this thread, it looks like some people have done the cam install without removing the crank pulley. Wouldn't it just be a matter of making sure the belt stays tight on the crank pulley so that it doesn't skip any teeth on the belt?

[MikeBlueP5]

yeah you can do that, but you also have to make sure the crank stays on the timing mark, its particularly hard to do when youre putting the belt back on the cam pulleys. I mean its doable because thats what i was going to originally do, but when i took the stock cam pulleys off the tensioner sucked all the slack out of the belt, so then i had to take the timing belt cover off to get to it and loosen it back up, and the only way to get it loosened is to remove the belt cover and it goes behind the crank pulley. all in all if youre lucky, good and take youre time, i dont see why it cant be done this way, just double and triple check all the timing marks the first time.

[Kansei]

yeah you can do that, but you also have to make sure the crank stays on the timing mark, its particularly hard to do when youre putting the belt back on the cam pulleys. I mean its doable because thats what i was going to originally do, but when i took the stock cam pulleys off the tensioner sucked all the slack out of the belt, so then i had to take the timing belt cover off to get to it and loosen it back up, and the only way to get it loosened is to remove the belt cover and it goes behind the crank pulley. all in all if youre lucky, good and take youre time, i dont see why it cant be done this way, just double and triple check all the timing marks the first time.

Yeah damn. stupid tensioner :(

I guess I have to go get an electric impact wrench from Sears or something. The new cam is in, the I is still pointing towards the E, but I can't get at the adjuster for the tensioner because of the lower cover. I really hope the impact wrench can fit in the space with the wheel turned all the way to the right, because I can't get that wheel off since the key didn't come today.

[MikeBlueP5]

if not, just get an extension and a swivel if you have to. but yeah thats the only way to get to the tensioner, you will also need an allen wrench to work it. Cant remember what size.

[Kansei]

if not, just get an extension and a swivel if you have to. but yeah thats the only way to get to the tensioner, you will also need an allen wrench to work it. Cant remember what size.

So there is no way to get the plastic cover off without removing the crank pulley, correct?

I wish I knew someone up here who had an impact wrench, or a place where I could rent one (if such a place even exists). This is the only bolt on the car I've ever needed an impact wrench for, so it seems crappy to pay so much to do it.

*crosses fingers* I hope Sears has the Makita half inch drive electric (corded) impact wrench in stock.

Edit: I'm considering getting in there and breaking the plastic cover off, and then when I am back home over thanksgiving break buy a new cover and use my dad's impact wrench to install it nicely.

[ahb11m]

Zverg - yes thats absoloutley correct

[MikeBlueP5]

yup cant get to it to without taking off the pulley if my memory serves me correct. good luck though, let us know what you end up doing.

[Kansei]

yup cant get to it to without taking off the pulley if my memory serves me correct. good luck though, let us know what you end up doing.

I dropped 300 bucks on compressor and impact wrench... crank pulley bolt came off very easily.

But.. one of the 14mm bolts that I need to loosen to loosen one of the belts is stripped, probably me from when I installed my underdrive pulley. Is there any other place where I can loosen the belt?

[MikeBlueP5]

you mean the head of it is stripped or the actual threaded part is?

[Kansei]

you mean the head of it is stripped or the actual threaded part is?

The head. I got the belt off, I just hope I can get it back on. What I did was remove all the other bolts holding the AC compressor in place, so that it was only attached by the stuck bolt. I could then rock it back and forth, and I rocked it toward the engine all the way (so it was resting against the block) and then I was able to pull the belt off. When I did my UDP install I replaced the similar bolt on the alternator with a new one, so that one was easy to loosen. I should get the part for my new air chisel and just cut the bolt off and replace it tomorrow.

[MikeBlueP5]

might not be a bad idea if there is enough there to use a pair of vise grips on to remove the bolt without the head. Which bolt is it?

[Kansei]

might not be a bad idea if there is enough there to use a pair of vise grips on to remove the bolt without the head. Which bolt is it?

It is the bolt that attaches the AC compressor to the "slider thing" that lets it adjust in and out. It's really short, 14mm. I think it is the same bolt as the corresponding one on the alternator (which I replaced when I did my UDP install) so I could go to home depot and match that one. Crap I think they close at 09:30 or 10, looks like I might not be able to do that until tomorrow morning.

[MikeBlueP5]

ah i gotcha. yeah that could pose as a problem when trying to adjust it for any reason. Sometimes when bolts thread into aluminum the kinda get "stuck" one trick i learned in a machine shop was to take a give it a few "love" taps on the head with a hammer and it will help loosen it up a tad. Lubricant always helps in the form of WD or PB Blaster <--that stuff will own WD though. I would try to use some vice's on it before cutting or chiseling it off.

[Kansei]

Hmm well I can access the adjustment for the pretentioner now, but now that all the markings I made on the timing belt earlier have worn off, I have no clue what I'm doing. Do I just set the crank so that the little groove on the rod is pointing straight up? As I recall, when it was all attached before I had to rotate past that point a couple times before the I pointed toward the E, I'm pretty screwed now huh?

[MikeBlueP5]

hang on a minute and ill send you a page of the shop manual and help ya out

[MikeBlueP5]

ok im trying to do all this by memory and my cams have been in the car almost 25k miles now so forgive me if im wrong on any of it. But you need to make sure that #1 is TDC you can do this by pulling the plug and watching the piston crown. there should be a timing mark on the block and the lower plastic cover, if i remember correctly. then the lobes on the #1 cylinder on the exhaust cam should point toward the radiator and the lobes of the intake cam should point towards the firewall. The key on both should be pointed straight up, with the other slots in the pullies facing the same way as the #1 lobes. When everything is lined up right the I and E will be dead even together with the top of the head were the valve cover gasket goes (the smooth machined surface between the first cam caps.

[Kansei]

ok im trying to do all this by memory and my cams have been in the car almost 25k miles now so forgive me if im wrong on any of it. But you need to make sure that #1 is TDC you can do this by pulling the plug and watching the piston crown. there should be a timing mark on the block and the lower plastic cover, if i remember correctly. then the lobes on the #1 cylinder on the exhaust cam should point toward the radiator and the lobes of the intake cam should point towards the firewall. The key on both should be pointed straight up, with the other slots in the pullies facing the same way as the #1 lobes. When everything is lined up right the I and E will be dead even together with the top of the head were the valve cover gasket goes (the smooth machined surface between the first cam caps.

Thanks a ton I'll give that a try.

[MikeBlueP5]

here is a pic of what im talking about
http://www.msprotege.com/members/MikeBlueP5/TIMING/timing.bmp

[Kansei]

here is a pic of what im talking about
http://www.msprotege.com/members/MikeBlueP5/TIMING/timing.bmp


Thanks, I got the belt on. All was well, until I noticed that the tensioner wasn't springing back. I manually turned it back into the tightened position, and then the tensioner spring fell onto the ground. It's definitely quite fatigued. *sigh*

Would an auto parts store carry the tensioner spring?

[MikeBlueP5]

i doubt it and is shouldnt be stretched, there is a certain way of doing it. I ran into this problem too. ill get that page of the manual. Also make sure when you get everything back together before you put all the covers back on make sure you rotate the whole assembly (put just the bolt back in the crank, and use it) two times to make sure all the timing marks are dead on. if not redo it, trust me dont even try and run it. if its off a little it will run and not mess up the pistons or valves, but it will run like shit, and you will have to redo it all again. but lemme get that tensioner page.

[MikeBlueP5]

ok heres the instructions on the tensioner spring, as you can see with it off the car the free length should be right under 1.5 inches.
http://www.msprotege.com/members/MikeBlueP5/TIMING2/timing.bmp

[Kansei]

ok heres the instructions on the tensioner spring, as you can see with it off the car the free length should be right under 1.5 inches.
http://www.msprotege.com/members/MikeBlueP5/TIMING2/timing.bmp

Yeah it's like 3 inches. Advance Auto Parts said that I'd have to get that part from the dealer, but I think I'll call around the other auto parts stores first. I would think the tensioner / tensioner spring would be fairly generic enough that an auto parts store would have it.

Are Mazda parts departments usually open on Sundays? I better put the new tube in the rear tire of my mountain bike because it looks like I'll be riding the 7 miles to campus for my 8am class tomorrow :(

Thanks for the help.

[MikeBlueP5]

i dont think dealership parts are open, and as far as the spring goes, i dont know if its anything special or not. You could try the different parts stores and see if you could match it up. Good luck though, lemme know if you need anymore help.

[Kansei]

i dont think dealership parts are open, and as far as the spring goes, i dont know if its anything special or not. You could try the different parts stores and see if you could match it up. Good luck though, lemme know if you need anymore help.

AutoZone sorta lists the tensioner, but then says that it is not available in store or online, not even as a special order. Looks like I'll be going to the parts department tomorrow, I hope they are open late enough. When one of my roommates wakes up I'll be able to get to the other auto parts stores to just see if they have a spring that would match up. I hope I don't need to replace the whole tensioner but I don't see why I would need to. If I have to wait until tomorrow I'll get a new timing belt too and get the #3 engine mount off, I got some oil on the timing belt so that probably isn't too good for it.

[MikeBlueP5]

yeah i got a little oil on my belt too, but i wiped it off, i guess if it breaks it breaks, they are non interference engines anyway, so no harm done. I didnt even take off the mount on mine, but i guess you kinda have to to put a new belt on. As far as the tensioner goes it shouldnt be bad. Just like the manual i posted above said, if it rotates (i believe with the allen wrench) with little or no resistance to replace it.

[Kansei]

Thanks everyone for the help, the job is done! w00t w00t!

[MikeBlueP5]

sweet! hope she treats ya well afterwards. what did you do about the spring?

[Kansei]

sweet! hope she treats ya well afterwards. what did you do about the spring?

Shh it's a secret. I bought a magical 3 dollar "assorted springs" pack from Lowes! It had one that so closely matches the one that was there, it fit nice and securely. I think I'll probably order a new timing belt and tensioner from Mazda at some point, I don't think it would be that bad to do the process again (minus the removing the cam part) now that I have the right tools.

[MazdaSpeed626]

Shh it's a secret. I bought a magical 3 dollar "assorted springs" pack from Lowes! It had one that so closely matches the one that was there, it fit nice and securely. I think I'll probably order a new timing belt and tensioner from Mazda at some point, I don't think it would be that bad to do the process again (minus the removing the cam part) now that I have the right tools.

Ummmm, do you really think that's such a great idea? Even though the springs may look the same, they are more than likely different. i.e. spring constant, number of coils, structural integrity, material, % efficiency of heat absorbsion, etc. Anyone of these things can cause problems...My bet is that it would break due to heat stress because its not automotive grade material(im assuming...). Just go to the dealer, its $4.35 or something like that.

Although, i can't say much cuz i didn't change mine when i did my timing belt and yet I still decided to by a new one 2 days after i completed the job(bang)...It continues to sit in my center console to this day.

[Kansei]

Ummmm, do you really think that's such a great idea? Even though the springs may look the same, they are more than likely different. i.e. spring constant, number of coils, structural integrity, material, % efficiency of heat absorbsion, etc. Anyone of these things can cause problems...My bet is that it would break due to heat stress because its not automotive grade material(im assuming...). Just go to the dealer, its $4.35 or something like that.

Although, i can't say much cuz i didn't change mine when i did my timing belt and yet I still decided to by a new one 2 days after i completed the job(bang)...It continues to sit in my center console to this day.

I understand that, but I needed a car to be able to get to class. All the auto parts stores I went to said I needed to go to the dealer (not open on weekends) or an "import part store" which isn't open on Sunday (when this was all going down). It's just a temporary fix, I should have replaced the timing belt when I was in there anyway so I'm ordering a new timing belt and the tensioner and doing the whole mess again, but after I'm done with finals next week.

[MazdaSpeed626]

damnnnnnn you already having finals???? must be nice, my semester doesn't end until december 5th or something...

[Kansei]

damnnnnnn you already having finals???? must be nice, my semester doesn't end until december 5th or something...

You call 10 week semesters where they cram in as much as most people have in normal length semesters fun? How about a 2 week winter break, spring break in February, only 1 week off between each semester.. yeah. It's a quarter system, with each quarter corresponding roughly to a season. It's the "fall" quarter right now.

[Raven Hawk]

I thought that I'd bump this thread for all the new cams that are coming in on the group buy.

[Crazee D]

Been reading it over and over...

Gotta get the gray RTV
and might as well get a new timing belt and spring

and print out a few more posts.
I'm anxious to start

[rotorhead22]

I used this thread to help my nephew change out his belt. When we checked the timing marks, one cam had turned slightly so we re-did it all to get the marks right. After getting it all back together, the initial start up was fine but when he started to drive home it kept dying at stop signs/lights. It has the symptoms of a vacuum leak but I cannot find any hoses undone. Any thoughts?

[flipmode815]

Do the jdm fs-ze cams install the same way since they are both the same cams just pinned different? Both cams have the same markings (FS9P)

[MikeBlueP5]

not sure by what you mean if they install the same way. they install the same way the stock ones come out. the intake lobes should be pointing towards the firewall and the exhaust lobes should be pointing towards the front/radiator when i think its 1 is at TDC

[turbo-pub]

it's so useful