How TO: CEL/MIL Eliminator!

[acidbbg]

PLEASE MAKE THIS A STICKY or Locate to the How To!

I have seen lots of questions about how to make your own MIL/CEL Eliminator..

Well its really simple!

Tools Needed:
Wire Cutters
Soldering Iron
Solder
Electrical Tape
1-M Ohm Resistor ($1 at Radio Shack)
1-uF Capacitor($1 at Radio Shack)
Adjustable Wrench

Step1:
-Pop Open the Hood and get a look at the 2nd Oxygen Sensor
-There is a clip..Push the clip in and pull out the Male-Female Connection
-Using Adjustable Wrench Remove the Oxygen Sensor

Step2:
-Go somewhere you can use your Soldering Iron
-Cut the Blue Wire
-Remove the Sheathing on the White wire to expose the Copper Wiring Underneath
-Grab you 1m Ohm resistor and solder it into the bluewires you cut earlier
-Grap your 1uF capactiro and solder it into the wire that you unsheathed/exposed & than solder it on the connector side as show on the Pic!
-Grab your electrical tape and make sure you do a good job covering all the conections

Step3:
-Reinstall using the reverse directions in step 1!

Typical install time is 15-20min depending on your ability to solder!

Chas

[acidbbg]

*Quick note, You might need to reset the ecu. But i did not have to!

how to reset ecu:
-Remove negative terminal to the battery
-wait 5 minutes
-reinstall the negative terminal to the battery!

Most common reasons to do this:
Install of a header that removes the 1st cat or both.
Turbo back that removes 1st cat or both!

When you remove either of the cats the ecu picks up that 1 of the cats are reading inconsistency(sp?) in the exhuast gasses which causes the Check Engine Light!

Chas

[Little Beavis]

Nice work!

The other option is to lengthen the wires and place the second O2 sensor after the second cat, this too will get rid of the CEL. But if your car is gut-less, whoops, I mean cat-less, than this is the way to go!

[Bigg Tim]

I have my 2nd O2 behind my high flow cat and when it's real cold, I get a P0421 code saying "Warm Up Catalyst below threshold (Bank 1)". Would doing this get rid of this CEL??? What do ya think Beavis??? I only have the 1 high flow cat and a 3" exhaust.

[acidbbg]

Nice work!

The other option is to lengthen the wires and place the second O2 sensor after the second cat, this too will get rid of the CEL. But if your car is gut-less, whoops, I mean cat-less, than this is the way to go!
Yeah..that's a good way to go..but for the price..it's worth doing..instead of having to lenghten wires and such!

I have my 2nd O2 behind my high flow cat and when it's real cold, I get a P0421 code saying "Warm Up Catalyst below threshold (Bank 1)". Would doing this get rid of this CEL??? What do ya think Beavis??? I only have the 1 high flow cat and a 3" exhaust.
it should defeintely fix your code..i don't have any codes..and i have had this mil eliminator on my ride since the days i had a header!

Chas
:)

[noclue119]

what does MIL stand for

[Bigg Tim]

Malfunction Indicator Lamp. Also known as a CEL or the check engine light.

[zmepro]

i know this is old, but is this exactly the same as the APEX MIL eliminator, what exactly does it to electricly to the system? is it reversable?

[acidbbg]

i know this is old, but is this exactly the same as the APEX MIL eliminator, what exactly does it to electricly to the system? is it reversable?
This is absolutley reversable(sp?)...It's just like the apex mil eliminator..but without the extra $$$ associated with purchasing it!(yes)

Basically what it does it tells the ecu that everything is normal..aka the car is not running rich...

Chas

[zmepro]

what does the ecu look for? temp? oxygen level? doesn't that change? or is it a constant thing (on/off) or is it variable?

[acidbbg]

what does the ecu look for? temp? oxygen level? doesn't that change? or is it a constant thing (on/off) or is it variable?
Basically the ecu compares the 2 oxygen sensors..to tell if it needs to add more fuel..or subtract fuel..or to throw a cel light..

Basically when you remove the 1st cat..the 2nd oxygen sensor will notice that there is alot more emmisions coming out...so by using the mil/cel eliminator..you trick the ecu into thinking that everything is ok!

Chas

[zmepro]

so if i didn't have the MIL it would cut fuel or run too rich?

[mrpopnfresh]

Thats a good question zmepro, I've been wondering the same thing for a while.

Acidbbg, great how-to, I'm going to try this one tonight!!

[acidbbg]

so if i didn't have the MIL it would cut fuel or run too rich?
Basically it will just throw the cel...It has been said that it would cause the car to run in limp mode(car runs really rich..to prevent any further damage)..but it has never been proven!

Chas

[Emode]

i think i remember a thread where someone had a a/f guage readings while the CEL was on and it was richer.
I also have compared milage on a trip with and without CEL and i do get terrible gas consumption with it on.

[acidbbg]

Well i had a cel..and i have a a/f guage..not a wide band..but an autometer! And didn't notice any difference..Other than bad gas mileage..but that's b/c i drive hard!

Chas

[melicha8]

So I was just thinking and this is for all you FI people. Wyh don't you try putting the first O2 sensor behind a cat so when it reads it will think that more fuel is needed so it adds more fuel and tada no more lean condition or correction by the ecu

[acidbbg]

So I was just thinking and this is for all you FI people. Wyh don't you try putting the first O2 sensor behind a cat so when it reads it will think that more fuel is needed so it adds more fuel and tada no more lean condition or correction by the ecu
i don't think that would help at all..the only thing..that really works..is the flying protege vaccum switch..which tells the ecu...that the car is running lean as hell and not to pull fuel!

Chas

[DSMConvert]

ok quick question...so if i remove both cats would I have to do this to both o2 sensors or just the 2nd one?

[acidbbg]

ok quick question...so if i remove both cats would I have to do this to both o2 sensors or just the 2nd one?
Just on the 2nd one! I know for a fact b/c i had a header on the car and removed both cats..and just put it into the 2nd o2 sensor!

Chas(yes)

[Glowmunkey]

Just for reference, the second O2 sensor just shows the ECU that the mixture isn't overly lean or rich, telling it the catalyst effectively eliminated unburned hydrocarbons. It "sees" a value outside of the acceptable range and throws a code to warn you it could be polluting. The second O2 has nothing to do with fuel management, that's the job of the first O2.

[YloDmonTurboMSP]

Ok, I'm confused? The picture seems to show what I thought was the first o2 sensor on the intake manifold? I'm i right or wrong thinking that the MIL goes on the sensor that is between the two cats underneath the hood? Please let me know if this is wrong because I installed it underneath and that would explain why I keep getting a CEL. Thanks.

[acidbbg]

Ok, I'm confused? The picture seems to show what I thought was the first o2 sensor on the intake manifold? I'm i right or wrong thinking that the MIL goes on the sensor that is between the two cats underneath the hood? Please let me know if this is wrong because I installed it underneath and that would explain why I keep getting a CEL. Thanks.
Sorry for the confustion..i will try to make my original post much more clearer...But It's the 2ND O2 SENSOR that gets the MIL eliminator!

Chas

[acidbbg]

PLEASE MAKE THIS A STICKY or Locate to the How To!

I have seen lots of questions about how to make your own MIL/CEL Eliminator..

Well its really simple!

Tools Needed:
Wire Cutters
Soldering Iron
Solder
Electrical Tape
1-M Ohm Resistor ($1 at Radio Shack)
1-uF Capacitor($1 at Radio Shack)
Adjustable Wrench

Step1:
-Pop Open the Hood and get a look at the 2nd Oxygen Sensor
-There is a clip..Push the clip in and pull out the Male-Female Connection
-Using Adjustable Wrench Remove the Oxygen Sensor

Step2:
-Go somewhere you can use your Soldering Iron
-Cut the Blue Wire
-Remove the Sheathing on the White wire to expose the Copper Wiring Underneath
-Grab you 1m Ohm resistor and solder it into the bluewires you cut earlier
-Grap your 1uF capactiro and solder it into the wire that you unsheathed/exposed & than solder it on the connector side as show on the Pic!
-Grab your electrical tape and make sure you do a good job covering all the conections

Step3:
-Reinstall using the reverse directions in step 1!

Typical install time is 15-20min depending on your ability to solder!

Chas

[ARunto]

i did this but i used just the resistor soldered in line on blue wire. works great :)

-Alan

[mrpopnfresh]

My engine is weird, for a few weeks it's ok, then for the next few weeks I throw a cel. I didn't solder the Mil Eliminator yet, but I did notice when the Check engine light is on, the car does run rich. (I have autometer a/f too) When the light is off, the car runs smother, but feels like it's lacking the power it had while running rich.

Just thought I'd add that in.

[Wild_MSP]

I'm not very good at electronics, so could some tell me if the 1-M Ohm resistor is supposed to be a 1/2watt or 1/4watt? (RadioShack has both!)

Thanks!

[mrpopnfresh]

I noticed on my Autometer A/F guage, that while the Cel is on, the car runs rich, when it's off, it runs normally.

[acidbbg]

I'm not very good at electronics, so could some tell me if the 1-M Ohm resistor is supposed to be a 1/2watt or 1/4watt? (RadioShack has both!)

Thanks!
Print out the sheet..and Just go in to Radio shack...I am sure they will know!

Chas

[walight01]

it doesn't matter the wattage on the resistor, get which everones are 99 cents the the cap at is 99cents, works great.

[joka1]

quick question?

-"Grab your 1uF capactiro and solder it into the wire that you unsheathed/exposed & than solder it on the connector side as show on the Pic!"
their is a plus side and a neg side, which one goes where????????? cause when my car was still running i still got my cell and i know i soldered it right and did it right. (i solder everyday at work) just curious it i hooked it up backwards?
rob

[acidbbg]

quick question?

-"Grab your 1uF capactiro and solder it into the wire that you unsheathed/exposed & than solder it on the connector side as show on the Pic!"
their is a plus side and a neg side, which one goes where????????? cause when my car was still running i still got my cell and i know i soldered it right and did it right. (i solder everyday at work) just curious it i hooked it up backwards?
rob
Did you reset the ecu? b/c if you don't it will not work!

dude..no need to worry about plug and negative sides..just but the 1m ohm..on the blue wire...
than splice the wite wire connecting the 1uf!

Chas


http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10435

[joka1]

ok, did that.... quick question........ i have no cats and if i put my o2 sensor back into my exhaust can i hook my a/f guage up to it (the second o2 sensor that is!! )
i know the wideband o2 sensor is better than the first o2 sensor!!!!!!!!! that is with this mod on the 2nd o2 sensor!!
rob

[acidbbg]

ok, did that.... quick question........ i have no cats and if i put my o2 sensor back into my exhaust can i hook my a/f guage up to it (the second o2 sensor that is!! )
i know the wideband o2 sensor is better than the first o2 sensor!!!!!!!!! that is with this mod on the 2nd o2 sensor!!
rob
Well i had my a/f gauge..back when i had both cats removed(due to my header)..my a/f guage has alwayz been connected to the 1st o2 sensor..so i don't know if it will give you accurate readings..b/c of the MIL ELiminator..changing the voltage!

Chas(homework)

[joka1]

ya but i heard the primary (narrowband) o2 sensor will give you a lightshow because of the changing voltages so much!

[acidbbg]

ya but i heard the primary (narrowband) o2 sensor will give you a lightshow because of the changing voltages so much!
both oxygen sensors are narrow band..as soon as i hit boost..i automagically go all the way green!

Chas;)

[joka1]

oopz,
rob

[TDK]

Ok, in my case i have a Haltech e6x computer installed. The stock ECU is still there, but that just runs things like the climate control, etc.

When i put the pedal to the ground i get a CEL. Shoudn't this not happen considering that i have a completey different computer running the car. If i implemented this HOW-TO, would it fix my problem.

Thanks.

[mrpopnfresh]

I have my A/F meter spliced into my ecu. Is this a problem? Would it be better to splice it with my actual 02 sensors? Also, I'm guessing there isn't, but is there a way I can get rid of a cel from my cam gears. I have adjustable cam gears and every now and then I thow a cell. I don't want to have to keep resetting my ECU. Thanks

[acidbbg]

Ok, in my case i have a Haltech e6x computer installed. The stock ECU is still there, but that just runs things like the climate control, etc.

When i put the pedal to the ground i get a CEL. Shoudn't this not happen considering that i have a completey different computer running the car. If i implemented this HOW-TO, would it fix my problem.

Thanks.
I dont' think the MIL eliminator will work for you..sounds like you don't have your e6k wired properly..what's the code you are gettin?

<TABLE class=tborder cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=6 width="100%" align=center border=0><TBODY><TR title="Post 824627" vAlign=top><TD class=alt1 align=middle width=125>mrpopnfresh</TD><TD class=alt2>I have my A/F meter spliced into my ecu. Is this a problem? Would it be better to splice it with my actual 02 sensors? Also, I'm guessing there isn't, but is there a way I can get rid of a cel from my cam gears. I have adjustable cam gears and every now and then I thow a cell. I don't want to have to keep resetting my ECU. Thanks</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
It's ok to splice into the ecu..but if there was ever a short..i would prefer it to be closer to the o2 sensor which is cheap..compared to a $1k ecu!

Can't help you on the cam gears...you shouldn't be getting any cel from them..there are a couple people running them..

Chas

[TDK]

I dont' think the MIL eliminator will work for you..sounds like you don't have your e6k wired properly..what's the code you are gettin?

How do you find out what code it gives you.

[acidbbg]

How do you find out what code it gives you.
u will need to get ahold of an ODB II scan tool..i just go to Autozone..the let me uses theirs free of charge...

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

How big/small should the resistor and capacitor be, physical size wise? They have a couple of different ones there. I got the 1/4 watt resistor and the 35wvdc capacitor. They are real small and from what memory serves, they are the same size as the ones I put in my friends WRX. I'll take some pics later, my battery is dead.

[acidbbg]

How big/small should the resistor and capacitor be, physical size wise? They have a couple of different ones there. I got the 1/4 watt resistor and the 35wvdc capacitor. They are real small and from what memory serves, they are the same size as the ones I put in my friends WRX. I'll take some pics later, my battery is dead.
Should be smaller than a cig in girth(width..and as small as your nail in lenght)!

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

Should be smaller than a cig in girth(width..and as small as your nail in lenght)!

ChasCheck out this pic. You can tell the size by comparing it to the staple in the package. I'm pretty sure the capacitor is correct, but the question is the resistor. The 1/2 watt one is a little bigger, like this size plus another half of it added on. What would happen if you put too small of one in there, would it do any damage? Zoom in if it isn't too clear of the size.

(http://www.msprotege.com/members/Bigg%20Tim/DSC00463.jpg)

[joka1]

thats the same sizes i used!
rob

[acidbbg]

Check out this pic. You can tell the size by comparing it to the staple in the package. I'm pretty sure the capacitor is correct, but the question is the resistor. The 1/2 watt one is a little bigger, like this size plus another half of it added on. What would happen if you put too small of one in there, would it do any damage? Zoom in if it isn't too clear of the size.
looks right to me..it really shouldn't do any damage..if it's not done correctly..it can cause the ecu..to put out a CEL saying that the Sensor is Bad..but really the connection is not correct!

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

Cool!!!

[joka1]

i have a quick question abt the o2 sensor........ which one is the signal wire (for my a/f guage) thanks
rob

[acidbbg]

i have a quick question abt the o2 sensor........ which one is the signal wire (for my a/f guage) thanks
robstolen from linux's how to:
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14164


http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/LinuxRacr/blue-pink%20on%20harness%20tapped.jpg
And here is the entire album:
http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/linuxrac...r+Shots&.view=t (http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/linuxracr/lst?.dir=/A-Pillar+Shots&.view=t)

To hook to the gauge itself, you will have to route through the firewall on the driver's side.

The A/F gauge itself usually has a positive (+) 12v wire, a ground (-), and the signal wire (that goes to pin #60). Find a suitable +12v source of ignition so that when you turn the ket to on, the gauge comes on. Anchor the ground (-) wire to chassis ground. In other words, find a screw going through the metal body of the car under the carpet under the driver's side kick panel, and ground it there with a loop anchor connector. The signal wire connection has already been discussed above. I hope all this helps!!<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[joka1]

thanks
rob

[CANMP3]

This may be a dumb question but I just installed the Ractive header and it has a bung for the first O2 sensor (the one on the right hand side if I am correct). The other O2 sensor is on the left hand side which was after the precat, and there is no hole for that anymore. I have no place to put this sensor now. For now I put it by my Injen intake. Now Im not all that smart when it comes to wiring but...do I need to have this sensor pluged into the exhaust to use this CEL cheater??

[Bigg Tim]

This may be a dumb question but I just installed the Ractive header and it has a bung for the first O2 sensor (the one on the right hand side if I am correct). The other O2 sensor is on the left hand side which was after the precat, and there is no hole for that anymore. I have no place to put this sensor now. For now I put it by my Injen intake. Now Im not all that smart when it comes to wiring but...do I need to have this sensor pluged into the exhaust to use this CEL cheater??
Yeah dude, the O2 HAS to be in the exhaust. It is doing absoultly nothing in the intake. It measures the air fuel ratio in the exhaust that has come out of the motor and "tells" the ECU what it is so the ECU can then add or remove fuel to keep it in at the 14.7 AFR it likes in closed loop.

If you have the first O2 in the header, then put the second one behind the CAT. If you don't have a CAT, then remove it and use the MIL eleminator to keep the Check engine light from coming on. Chas may need to answer about not having the O2 in the system to use the MIL fix. I never had a header, so I don't know.

[Bigg Tim]

Chas--On which wire does the + side of the capcitor go to? I put it to the blue wire, is it right?

[Slickfabo]

I just ggot a exhuast that removes both cats on my msp ans dosnt have a bunge for the o2 sensor. if i put the cel eliminator on and tuck the senors some where safe and wrap it up will it still throw a cel?

[acidbbg]

Chas--On which wire does the + side of the capcitor go to? I put it to the blue wire, is it right?
Yeah..that's right..the + side..ddin't matter when i installed it!


I just ggot a exhuast that removes both cats on my msp ans dosnt have a bunge for the o2 sensor. if i put the cel eliminator on and tuck the senors some where safe and wrap it up will it still throw a cel?

I had to do the same thing with the head i had on my car..a while ago..there was no bung hole for the 2nd o2 sensor..so i just wire tied it out of the way...and didn't get any CEL!

Chas

[pr5owner]

Yeah..that's right..the + side..ddin't matter when i installed it!


I had to do the same thing with the head i had on my car..a while ago..there was no bung hole for the 2nd o2 sensor..so i just wire tied it out of the way...and didn't get any CEL!

Chas
i wrapped my o2 sensor up in electrical tape, should i just leave it open in the air? cuz i threw a cel but the cel took ALOT LONGER to come on than having the o2 sensor not plugged in, does the o2 sensor need to be hot as well? or does the computer ONLY read o2?

[CANMP3]

i wrapped my o2 sensor up in electrical tape, should i just leave it open in the air? cuz i threw a cel but the cel took ALOT LONGER to come on than having the o2 sensor not plugged in, does the o2 sensor need to be hot as well? or does the computer ONLY read o2?
I also have my O2 sensor wrapped up. I just zipped tied it to my intake so it does not rattle around.

[acidbbg]

i wrapped my o2 sensor up in electrical tape, should i just leave it open in the air? cuz i threw a cel but the cel took ALOT LONGER to come on than having the o2 sensor not plugged in, does the o2 sensor need to be hot as well? or does the computer ONLY read o2?
Yeah..you can just leave it in the engine compartment...just zip tie it..so it won't fall/rattle!

Not sure about the heat..i basically zip tied it to where the male-female connectors are...Not sure why you are throwing a cel...you shouldn't keep the o2 sensor unplugged..it will def cause your car to run rich...very rich!

Also don't wrap entire o2 sensor up in electrical tape..it's not needed..(rlaugh)

Did you solder all connections?? If not you will throw another cel!

Chas

[CANMP3]

I have tried this 2 times now, and both times I threw a CEL. I know the last time the soddering is good so they are connected. I have my O2 wrapped up as well and ziptied to something in the car.
Would there be any other way to get rid of the CEL.

[acidbbg]

I have tried this 2 times now, and both times I threw a CEL. I know the last time the soddering is good so they are connected. I have my O2 wrapped up as well and ziptied to something in the car.
Would there be any other way to get rid of the CEL.
Have you pulled the code from the ecu? What does it say? I am not sure why you are still getting a cel? Did you solder into the 2nd o2 sensor or first? There is another way..but you would have to relocate both o2 sensor behind the cat!

Chas

[CANMP3]

The 2nd O2 sensor is what I soddered into (it has the longer wires). How do I get the code from the ECU? Also would a premade cheater work?? I believe apexi or someone like this has one out.

[acidbbg]

you get the codes by plugging into the obd II connector..just go to any autozone..and they will help you out free of charge!

I have heard people have problems with apexi & poneyexpress...

Chas

[CANMP3]

Remember I live in Canada, nothing is free, and there are not Autozones. Will go to a shop to see though.

[acidbbg]

Yeah..just go to any mechanic's shop...they all should own an obdII scanner...worst comes to worst..puchase one..use it..and return for your money back!

:p

[Adam3482P]

I have my first O2 sensor unplugged. When It was plugged in the car seemed to run like crap. It seems to run alot better with it just unplugged. I was thinking of trying this but I dont know if I should plug the first O2 sensor back in or what?

[acidbbg]

yeah def plug it back in..not sure why it was runnin better..if anything it should make the idle rough..and driving conditions poor to overly rich condition!

You might have worn out the o2 sensor..but that just a thought!

Chas

[SilentSno]

acid, thanks for this how-to man! I installed the OBX/Forza Tuning header with your CEL elim worked great! I've got about 300 miles sense the install and no CEL.

[acidbbg]

(headbang) (nana) (cool) acid, thanks for this how-to man! I installed the OBX/Forza Tuning header with your CEL elim worked great! I've got about 300 miles sense the install and no CEL.

[pr5owner]

RWAAWRAWRWARWRWAWRAWAR, i soldered my connections GOOD, am i supposed to be using a "1 MOhm" as in "1 MEGA OHM" as in "1000 Kohms" as in "1 000 000 ohms"? as in brown - black - green - gold (well tolerance doesn't really matter)

maybe i have the cap in the wrong way, there is a longer lead on the cap and i have that connected to the resistor instead of the white wire, would this be it? or should i just get a non polorized cap?

[acidbbg]

RWAAWRAWRWARWRWAWRAWAR, i soldered my connections GOOD, am i supposed to be using a "1 MOhm" as in "1 MEGA OHM" as in "1000 Kohms" as in "1 000 000 ohms"? as in brown - black - green - gold (well tolerance doesn't really matter)

maybe i have the cap in the wrong way, there is a longer lead on the cap and i have that connected to the resistor instead of the white wire, would this be it? or should i just get a non polorized cap?http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10435

1. are u sure your doing this into the 2nd o2 sensor?
2. did you check your check engine light to see what code it was?

Not sure why you are having so many problems...I am not sure about the non polarized cap...i just went into radio shack..handed them my sheet..and they handed me 1 generic 1mohm & 1 generic 1uf!

(confused)

[pr5owner]

LOL of course its the 2nd o2 sensor, the other one is plugged into the ractive header, im not a crappy solderer either, ive taken electronics fab, and ive made tons of circuit boards, i did not wire it wrong, im pretty sure its the cap, it the only vairable, if this won't work i need to get new components,

[acidbbg]

Uh..i belive you..just trying to trouble shoot..b/c this cel fix has worked for over 10protege's!

if you can't get it to work...maybe the pi8eces you bought were no good from the start?

Chas

[pr5owner]

that is possible that the cap is dead, the tested the resistor with my multimeter, its good, 1 016 000 ohms, maybe its the polarized cap, i will try it with the ground lead in the blue wire today, i will have to drive about 100 KMS to make sure, anyways if it doesn't work im going to radioshack for a non pol cap and a new resistor. oh BTW what voltages are going thru the blue and white wire?

[Bigg Tim]

Check out page 3, theres a pic of the ones that worked for me.(thumb)

[pr5owner]

yeah thats non polarized... ahh crap.. well we'll se what happens when the negative lead is connected to the blue wire instead of the white one

[CANMP3]

pr5owner, I have a non polarized one and tried it a couple of times with the ractive header, no workie for me.

[acidbbg]

I doubt the header has anything to do w/ the CEL FIX workin or not!

My guess is that you 2 guys..have purchased the wrong equipment...i am sorry i can not help any further..i am not an electrician...just a tuner!

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

yeah thats non polarized... ahh crap.. well we'll se what happens when the negative lead is connected to the blue wire instead of the white one
If they're polarized, then putting the + end on the other wire should work. If anyone wants some resistors, I have like 4 left I'll send them for free!

[P5 Rally]

is it possible to get 2 factory male and female connectors and wire the necessary CEL eliminator components in between these 2 connectors as indicated in the diagram, and have it work as if it were soldered in place?

just a thought

[pr5owner]

i went out to buy some non polarized caps but they are the block kind, not the tantalum ones, and some 1/2 watt resistors @ 1MOHM still not working, i am going to buy a OBDII reader or some diagnostic code thing to see WTF my car is thinking

[FunkyBuddha]

Just help me install my header, plug this 2nd o2 in and let's see for ourselves! When are you free this week?

[mrpopnfresh]

is it possible to get 2 factory male and female connectors and wire the necessary CEL eliminator components in between these 2 connectors as indicated in the diagram, and have it work as if it were soldered in place?

just a thought
I wanted to do the same thing, and yes it would work, the problem is the cost for the male and female peices.

[pr5owner]

i got a obdII reader, the code is 0140, which is no circuit activity, im thinking the resistor is too big, its not letting any kind of current thru im gonna try ONLY a 1K ohm resistor with no cap, if i throw a cel i will try the cap, if i throw one after that i'll go weld a bung, trouble shooting is gay

[P5 Rally]

awesome.....
that is my plan....i wanna be able to disconnect electrical components without having to hack at wires if i ever wanna sell my ride and return it to stock!!

do you remember the part numbers for those connectors?

I wanted to do the same thing, and yes it would work, the problem is the cost for the male and female peices.

[mrpopnfresh]

Well, if you do have to sell your car, all you'd have to do is reconnect the cut wires and cover them up with shrink wrap. No one would ever know what you did to it.

As for the part numbers, I don't remember them, but you could go to any mazda dealer and they should be able to get it for you.

[pr5owner]

pr5owner, I have a non polarized one and tried it a couple of times with the ractive header, no workie for me.try to find out what code you are geting, the stupid ODB2 tool is 250CAD (stupid fukers) anyways if you are getting a 140 then you have the same problem as me, i think maybe a wire going to ECU is fried or something... it should be saying another code

HOW EASY is it to damage an O2 sensor? like ive handled it quite a bit for solder and resolder, its a big peice of metal so i was assuming it wouldn't be as hard to break as something like your MAF sensor

[pr5owner]

well just got a bung welded in, and got a NEW CHECK ENGINE CODE!! YAY!! my 02 sensor still works, now i get catalyst warmup below threshold!! yes!! what im supposed to get, now im going to throw in my cel eliminator and see if it works, so i guess you cant use the eliminator without a bung

[pr5owner]

check engine light..... resolved, oh baby!!! thanks acid!

[acidbbg]

(p5white) (mswerd) (lol2) (guitar) (nana) (headbang) (cool) (birthday) check engine light..... resolved, oh baby!!! thanks acid!

[CANMP3]

Congrats, where did you get the bung welded into?? also how many clicks on your car since you did this.

[blaxer]

Anyone know how the O2 sensor works? I was assuming that it would output a DC voltage proportional to the O2 content of the exhaust gas. If this DIY fix is correct, then all it is doing is putting a 1Hz filter on the signal from the O2 sensor to the ECU. To me, this implies that the signal is AC.

As far as polarized caps go, I would suggest not using an electrolytic cap because they can't take the heat for very long. Also, if you connect a tantalum cap in backwards then it will eventually fail to a short, which would throw a CEL suggesting that the O2 sensor was not working at all. I have no idea if this would cause damage to the ECU, but I don't suspect it wouldn't. For temperature and install reasons, I think that a ceramic cap would be best.

I'm curious now also, anyone find out what the P/N for the male and female connectors are?

[acidbbg]

Anyone know how the O2 sensor works? I was assuming that it would output a DC voltage proportional to the O2 content of the exhaust gas. If this DIY fix is correct, then all it is doing is putting a 1Hz filter on the signal from the O2 sensor to the ECU. To me, this implies that the signal is AC.

As far as polarized caps go, I would suggest not using an electrolytic cap because they can't take the heat for very long. Also, if you connect a tantalum cap in backwards then it will eventually fail to a short, which would throw a CEL suggesting that the O2 sensor was not working at all. I have no idea if this would cause damage to the ECU, but I don't suspect it wouldn't. For temperature and install reasons, I think that a ceramic cap would be best.

I'm curious now also, anyone find out what the P/N for the male and female connectors are?
sorry not an electrician..but works on ac..check it out by using a voltage meter.

doubt it will cuase damage..the only thing that would cause damamge to ecu is a short in wiring..which would feed directly into ecu..

no idea on p/n for the connectors...

Chas(boom07)

[FunkyBuddha]

Ok, today I have travelled officially over 100km. No CEL w/ the ractive header. The 2nd o2 bung was welded into the collector. I will keep you guys up to date w/ progress. It might come on later. I have a feeling it might come on.

[pr5owner]

Congrats, where did you get the bung welded into?? also how many clicks on your car since you did this.
i welded it after the ractive header connects to the stock pipeing

like this.. header 4-->1--> endpoint --> round gasket thing --> stock endpoint --> bung --> 2nd cat

ive driving almost 1000 kms now, no precode, no cel, NOTHING,

[pr5owner]

Anyone know how the O2 sensor works? I was assuming that it would output a DC voltage proportional to the O2 content of the exhaust gas. If this DIY fix is correct, then all it is doing is putting a 1Hz filter on the signal from the O2 sensor to the ECU. To me, this implies that the signal is AC.

As far as polarized caps go, I would suggest not using an electrolytic cap because they can't take the heat for very long. Also, if you connect a tantalum cap in backwards then it will eventually fail to a short, which would throw a CEL suggesting that the O2 sensor was not working at all. I have no idea if this would cause damage to the ECU, but I don't suspect it wouldn't. For temperature and install reasons, I think that a ceramic cap would be best.

I'm curious now also, anyone find out what the P/N for the male and female connectors are?the o2 sensor mesures how much o2 is left after the burn cycle, the 1st o2 sensor will display something close to a sin wave, meaning lots of o2, lots of unburned fuel and CO, the 2nd o2 sensor will display the same thing except the amplitude of the wave will be alot smaller, since the cat will have burned the rest of the excess fuel, got rid of the CO so all theres left is CO2 and H20, your cel will come on if it sees the same thing as your 1st o2 sensor (which it will with a header) since it thinks your cat isn't warming up to burn the rest of the fuel and convert CO to CO2. also the code you SHOULD be getting is P0421 (i think) it should be catalyst warmup below threshold bank 1 (meaning the cat is taking too long to warm up to do its job, probably because its not there lol)

[FunkyBuddha]

Ok..CEL came on after 117km.

[blaxer]

the o2 sensor mesures how much o2 is left after the burn cycle, the 1st o2 sensor will display something close to a sin wave, meaning lots of o2, lots of unburned fuel and CO, the 2nd o2 sensor will display the same thing except the amplitude of the wave will be alot smaller, since the cat will have burned the rest of the excess fuel, got rid of the CO so all theres left is CO2 and H20, your cel will come off if it sees the same thing as your 1st o2 sensor (which it will with a header) since it thinks your cat isn't warming up to burn the rest of the fuel and convert CO to CO2

Alright, thanks for the info on the O2 sensor. The filter trick makes sense now.

[mrpopnfresh]

Acidbdg, I hooked up the Mil Eliminator just like you said. It was working PERFECTLY, but just recently I threw a cel again. I didn't check to see what it was, but I'm sure it's the O2 sensor. What should I do? Do I have to do it over again?

[acidbbg]

Check the code! Unless you know what the code is I cannot help trouble shoot!

Chas

[pr5owner]

Acidbdg, I hooked up the Mil Eliminator just like you said. It was working PERFECTLY, but just recently I through a cel again. I didn't check to see what it was, but I'm sure it's the O2 sensor. What should I do? Do I have to do it over again?
is your o2 sensor just hanging there? or is it inside a bung? and how many kms did you drive before it come on?

[mrpopnfresh]

is your o2 sensor just hanging there? or is it inside a bung? and how many kms did you drive before it come on?
All of my o2 sensors are plugged into a bung. I don't know the exact mileage I've got with the eliminator in, but I know I've got well over 200 miles on it.

I know for sure it's the mil eliminator because I let Sukegirl_mp3 use my headers. Her car is completely stock and she threw a cell about 1 week after we swaped. I don't know how many miles she put on her car though. I just want to know if I need to redo the mod or what not so when I take the headers off of her car, I can fix it before putting it into my car. Thanks.

[acidbbg]

Get the code! The chances are:

1. you are getting a new cel relating to something else.
2. problems with your current wiring of the fix!

chas

[pr5owner]

well here is how it goes

Code p0140 = bad connection broken contact somewhere
Code p0241 = bad components resistor is a short, cap is dead, etc

[acidbbg]

well here is how it goes

Code p0140 = bad connection broken contact somewhere
Code p0241 = bad components resistor is a short, cap is dead, etc
Sounds like a problem with your wiring...

I suggest..returning it back to stock..and make sure you really solder the connection really well (aka heating up wire than adding soldder.)
Than resetting the ecu...see what code you get!

if you get the catalist insufficent whatever code..than you know there was something wrong with the parts you picked up!

G/luck

chas(boom07)

[pr5owner]

p0140 is no circuit activity detected, as in bad solder job, broken contacts
p0241 is warm up cat below threshold, (cat is not doing its job) which means components are bad and not cheating the system

[acidbbg]

My bad...sounds like you understand yo problem! Need to solder better!

Chas

[pr5owner]

lol must be really bad, i didn't even solder my mil kill in i used bullet connectors so i can take it out when i want LOL

[DSMConvert]

Hey guys keep your eyes peeled, I shoud have pics and DIY up tonight for re routing the o2 gauge for the dp hole without cutting any wires! I repeat moving the o2 sensor without cutting any wires an without getting close to anything hot!!!

[acidbbg]

Hey guys keep your eyes peeled, I shoud have pics and DIY up tonight for re routing the o2 gauge for the dp hole without cutting any wires! I repeat moving the o2 sensor without cutting any wires an without getting close to anything hot!!!
Kewl..that's good to hear..we need more how to's!

Chas(silly)

[trbomp5]

anybody know where to get an 02 bung? I need 2 to weld onto my new downpipe. Or at the least what is the thread size and i can try to locate one.

[pr5owner]

take it to homedepot and try fittin on some big nuts...

[acidbbg]

anybody know where to get an 02 bung? I need 2 to weld onto my new downpipe. Or at the least what is the thread size and i can try to locate one.
actaully it's really simple..just go to mieneke..or any exhuast shop..they will sell cheaper than any hardware store!

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

Actually, you can go to a parts store and get a spark plug extender or something like that. I went to advanced auto aprts and got a pack that had 2 in it for like 4 or 5 bucks. I don't remeber exactly what they are called, but it has something to do with a sparkplug. You just have to cut the end off so you only have the part with the threads.

[unwound]

Actually, you can go to a parts store and get a spark plug extender or something like that. I went to advanced auto aprts and got a pack that had 2 in it for like 4 or 5 bucks. I don't remeber exactly what they are called, but it has something to do with a sparkplug. You just have to cut the end off so you only have the part with the threads.
they are called spark plug anti-foulers. i have them on my msp w/ corksport exhaust. use the 18mm ones and just drill out the bottom of one of them with a 1/2" drill bit (do not cut it off) and screw them into each other. it creates a chamber outside the main exhaust fow for the o2 to get a proper reading. suby guys have been doing this for a while with no cel/mil.

[trbomp5]

Thanks alot! Everybody here is so damn helpful!!!

[trbomp5]

sorry one other question, i just called radio shack and he wanted to know what wattage of resister i need. anybody tell me please!

[Bigg Tim]

sorry one other question, i just called radio shack and he wanted to know what wattage of resister i need. anybody tell me please!
I used the 1/4 watt ones. There's a pic of what I used on page 3. I'll have one in the mail for ya tomorrow.

[Bigg Tim]

they are called spark plug anti-foulers. i have them on my msp w/ corksport exhaust. use the 18mm ones and just drill out the bottom of one of them with a 1/2" drill bit (do not cut it off) and screw them into each other. it creates a chamber outside the main exhaust fow for the o2 to get a proper reading. suby guys have been doing this for a while with no cel/mil.
That's right, the anti fouler. I cut mine off so it sits in the exhaust like the stock one did, is this going to cause an issue? I was told to do this by an exhaust shop. I figured I could use the other one for my WBO2.

[trbomp5]

Were did you get the anti fouler from? The guy at autozone was no help.

[Bigg Tim]

Were did you get the anti fouler from? The guy at autozone was no help.
It's in the isle that has those things that have "help" or something like that on it. There will be vacuum Tees, brass fittings and things like that.

[trbomp5]

Cool, I'll look tonight. The 900 year old guy at AutoJerks, was like "Ya we have em", I said "Do you have an 18mm one?" He said "I know for sure we do not have that". Said they havent used 18mm spark plugs since 1930. I thought to myself, I'm pretty sure they didnt even use metric spark plugs in 1930. What a moron.

[acidbbg]

ha Ha ha..That sounds like pep boyz!

Chas

[trbomp5]

Well Advance had them in about 6 different sizes. They had 18mm in straight and tapered thread. I hate AutoJerks. Im not trying to be racist here but if your gonna work in customer service please dont be a million years old and please PLEASE learn english.
They were like $5.95 there and they came with the washers. Cool. Im gonna get them welded up on the new downpipe next week.
Now im gonna do the doubling them up trick, nobody has had a problem with it this way correct? Like the air up in the little "chamber" doesnt sit a hair longer and not be en exact depiction of the current exhaust co2?
Maybe im being over analytical here.

[blaxer]

Ok, so I installed my header and MIL fix at the same time. All was well for about 85 miles and then threw the CEL. Took it to Autozone and got code 0140 (No Circuit Activity). Removed my O2 sensor and I've ohm'd everything out, resistor measures 1M and the cap is not a short. Reset the ECU and got the code again about 85 miles later.

What should I do? I'm thinking that I should remove the fix and make sure that I get the other CEL that my cat isn't working. At least with that I can verify that my O2 sensor is stilll working.

Couple of questions though:
-When I throw the CEL without the MIL fix my car will run rich. Is there any potential for damage under this condition?
-Is the first O2 sensor the same as the second O2 sensor (just in case I have to replace it)?

Thanks.

[unwound]

Ok, so I installed my header and MIL fix at the same time. All was well for about 85 miles and then threw the CEL. Took it to Autozone and got code 0140 (No Circuit Activity). Removed my O2 sensor and I've ohm'd everything out, resistor measures 1M and the cap is not a short. Reset the ECU and got the code again about 85 miles later.

What should I do? I'm thinking that I should remove the fix and make sure that I get the other CEL that my cat isn't working. At least with that I can verify that my O2 sensor is stilll working.

Couple of questions though:
-When I throw the CEL without the MIL fix my car will run rich. Is there any potential for damage under this condition?
-Is the first O2 sensor the same as the second O2 sensor (just in case I have to replace it)?

Thanks.
ans1: basically you will just get bad gas mileage. yor sensors and egr valve might, and i say might, fail a little premature. your engine won't blow up or anything so try not to worry too much.

ans2: yes they are the same, you can even get a universal o2 as long as it is a 4-wire o2 sensor.

check the soldering on your connections.

try the anti-foulers too, they work and no screwing with the wires. have them installed on my msp for 800 miles w/ no CEL/MIL.

good luck

[riz]

i installed this fix today. had to reset my ecu... the CEL is off now. but doesn't it take a few starts or something before i'll see if its worked?

[pr5owner]

make sure your cap isn't polarized as well, and yes solder connections

riz, it takes KM/Miles to turn on the CEL light again

[riz]

make sure your cap isn't polarized as well, and yes solder connections

riz, it takes KM/Miles to turn on the CEL light again
how many miles?

[blaxer]

Well, got another CEL once I removed the MIL fix and it was the 0241 code (2thumbs). That means I don't have to replace my O2 sensor. Being that I had no luck with the MIL fix, I picked up the 2 anti foulers and am trying that. I should know if that did the trick in a couple of miles.

Mine took about 80 miles to throw the 0140 CEL and 30 miles to throw the 0241 CEL. I guess if this doesn't work, then I just have one of the anti foulers welded in behind the cat.

[acidbbg]

i installed this fix today. had to reset my ecu... the CEL is off now. but doesn't it take a few starts or something before i'll see if its worked?
That depends..on if you purchase the correct equipment...and if you installed it properly.

Usually it's about 100-150miles..depends on the problem.

Chas

[Bigg Tim]

Check out the pics on page 3, they are the ones I used and it's working great for me. They show the packages and all so you can get the correct ones.

[FrigginGLI]

What if you have a header and you just keep resetting the ecu whenever the check engine light comes on? Will that suffice? Or will it still not be getting total performance even thoe the light is not on anymore?

[acidbbg]

What if you have a header and you just keep resetting the ecu whenever the check engine light comes on? Will that suffice? Or will it still not be getting total performance even thoe the light is not on anymore?
Yeah that will be sufficeint..but it will also reset all your raidio stations..not to mention..the ecu will have to relearn the maps every time..so your idle will be wierd sometimes..

Chas

[FrigginGLI]

Bleh dont listen to the radio, my radio has a battery memory anyway. As long as it's fine if I keep resetting it don't seem like a big deal to me.

[xelderx]

What if you have a header and you just keep resetting the ecu whenever the check engine light comes on? Will that suffice? Or will it still not be getting total performance even thoe the light is not on anymore?
I don't think the car will be running at optimum performance while the ECU is trying to re-learn the settings. I kept reseting mine for several monthes until I finally got around to installing the fix. It may be my imagination, but the car seemed much more responsive after serveral hundred miles with no CEL. Once the ECU re-learned with the CEL fix in place the car seemed quicker.

[P54DRIDE]

Does it have to be a uF capcitor??? I bought a capacitor, but I'm not sure if it's a uF.

[pr5owner]

Does it have to be a uF capcitor??? I bought a capacitor, but I'm not sure if it's a uF.
LOL yes it does matter it must be EXACALY 1uF (1 micro Farad) or else the sign wave it makes will be off or out of phase or something and the ecu will bitch at you again

[bonesmp5]

which on am i suppost to use --- this one http://www.msprotege.com/vbb300/attachment.php?attachmentid=13069
or an Electrolytic capacitor
i assume they both work but one will handle the heat better :)

[trbomp5]

my cap is diff, I'll scan it and someone please tell me if its right?

(sorry the dig cam is on loan right now)

[bonesmp5]

so that means we have at least 3 different ones available -- so all you gurus-- whats the best/correct one to use -- i like doing things once if you know what i mean :)


Help :) pick one -- pick one --- hehehehe

[dosle]

on my receipt it says 1 MFD @ 50V for .99c
and PK5 1 MEG 1/4 W .99

lost the box sorry.

[trbomp5]

The one I posted was supposed to be good for the heat. I asked for a matalized one, but he said they did not have it and said this one should be good.

[Bigg Tim]

The little one was mine and I have mine back under the car about were your feet sit. I have the O2 extended due to my setup, so maybe you would want the metalized one to help with the heat resistance if it is closer to the exhaust. The pics I posted are still working great for me and it has been a couple of months, I think.

[bonesmp5]

so basicly -- all three can work as long as it says (1-uF Capacitor ) the difference is -- if i understand right-- how well they stand the heat -- right ?? and it also has to be non-polarized ??

thanks for the help -- i just want it right the first time -- i hate trouble shooting :)

[dosle]

so basicly -- all three can work as long as it says (1-uF Capacitor ) the difference is -- if i understand right-- how well they stand the heat -- right ?? and it also has to be non-polarized ??

thanks for the help -- i just want it right the first time -- i hate trouble shooting :)
i do know that non polarised is the way to go because you can not hook it up the wrong current direction :)

[PFUNK5]

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=66840

I don't mean to double post...but if this helps...

[PFUNK5]

which on am i suppost to use --- this one http://www.msprotege.com/vbb300/attachment.php?attachmentid=13069
or an Electrolytic capacitor
i assume they both work but one will handle the heat better :)
I used an electrylitic capacitor...it's small, has a blue cylinder shaped figure, about 1/2 inch size...as far as hooking up the ohm resister...use a .5 WATT, that's what I'm using, and it's been over 150 miles on my car w/o a cel, with the new header on.

[bonesmp5]

this is so confuzing -- some say that this type of this will work but others no that type wont work -- you need this type of that type ----- Damn some one needs to up date this section of the How-too

all it says is a 1-Mohm resistor and a 1-uf Capacitor -- so we go down there only to find that there are at least 3 types of each to choose from and we are left there scratching are heads going ---- OK which one ?? --

So then we come home to has for help in the forum and all we get is different answers -- one says this type works and the other says NO this type works and some say you need a 1/2 watt while others say they have the 1/4 with no problems ----

so can you see how this can be confusing -- i dont want to trouble shoot and if the Mil really works than in the How-too part it should list EXACTLY which part to buy --

anyways -- this is just me venting from not having only one answer -- so peace out and have a good weekend :)

[Bigg Tim]

The ones I posted the pics of have been working for me for some time now. I have no CEL and I used to get them everyday. You can make out the PN's from the pic, and if it doesn't work then your only out like 2 bucks. Those will work fine!

[bonesmp5]

can doing the cel fix cause poor gas milage ?????

i had a full take before doing the cel fix -- when it got empty i had only driven 240 miles after the cel fix -- i allways get around 330 when empty --- so why such a big change -- maybe because i reset my ecu ?? well i filled up today so we will see if this continues -- hope not :(

[dosle]

i am actually getting better mileage i noticed. there could be a lot of variables however..

[P5 Rally]

i purchased the capacitor and the resisitor that is specified in the wiring diagram on the first page....That will be sufficient, right Acidbbg?

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10435

I showed the short dude behind the counter at a local electronics shop and he turned around and 10 seconds later he turned around with stuff that looked exactly like the peices in the pic on page 3

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13069

[acidbbg]

can doing the cel fix cause poor gas milage ?????

i had a full take before doing the cel fix -- when it got empty i had only driven 240 miles after the cel fix -- i allways get around 330 when empty --- so why such a big change -- maybe because i reset my ecu ?? well i filled up today so we will see if this continues -- hope not :(
Actually...I have done many tests when it came to Cel & Gas mileage..and when i had the CEL...my gas mileage dropped..noticeabley..But after the Fix...within 2 Tanks fills..i noticed better mileage. Don't forget that the ecu learns..so everytime you reset it..it has to relearn maps and such.

Chas(homework)

[acidbbg]

i purchased the capacitor and the resisitor that is specified in the wiring diagram on the first page....That will be sufficient, right Acidbbg?

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10435

I showed the short dude behind the counter at a local electronics shop and he turned around and 10 seconds later he turned around with stuff that looked exactly like the peices in the pic on page 3

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13069
Yes it will def be sufficient!

But a quick suggestion..is to pull the ECU code..to make sure you know what it is. B/c this cel fix will only work on ECU code..insuffcient cat warmup.

Chas

[P5 Rally]

But a quick suggestion..is to pull the ECU code..to make sure you know what it is. B/c this cel fix will only work on ECU code..insuffcient cat warmup.

Chas
what do you mean by this!!? I have not yet installed my header or CEL fix so at this point everything is normal

[acidbbg]

what do you mean by this!!? I have not yet installed my header or CEL fix so at this point everything is normal
Ah..sorry..i thought you already installed.

Chas

[20EVOLUTION01]

Ok, Just to get is strait. I bought the 4-2-1 header for my Protege. All I have to do is install the cel/mil fix but also reset the computer. Then I may experience some less fuel economy but as soon as the comp learns I should be fine, Right? Will this happen or does it depend on every car or does it depend how heavy your foot is or maybe all of the above. Well all in all I hope it all works well for me. I am waiting for the Header. It should be in by this weekend from Cali. (headbang) Can't wait.

[bonesmp5]

ill let you know if my lack of fuel economy was because the ecu was learning at the end of my second tank -- about 4or5 days unless the gasmilage sucks again

[Bigg Tim]

Ok, Just to get is strait. I bought the 4-2-1 header for my Protege. All I have to do is install the cel/mil fix but also reset the computer. Then I may experience some less fuel economy but as soon as the comp learns I should be fine, Right? Will this happen or does it depend on every car or does it depend how heavy your foot is or maybe all of the above. Well all in all I hope it all works well for me. I am waiting for the Header. It should be in by this weekend from Cali. (headbang) Can't wait.
You could just get the code erased then you don't have to worry about relearning. Some parts places will do it for free.

[pr5owner]

i will do it for 5 dollars :)

[bonesmp5]

can doing the cel fix cause poor gas milage ?????

i had a full take before doing the cel fix -- when it got empty i had only driven 240 miles after the cel fix -- i allways get around 330 when empty --- so why such a big change -- maybe because i reset my ecu ?? well i filled up today so we will see if this continues -- hope not :(
ok for those interested -- i filled up today which is the second fill after the install of the header and MIL -- as you can see the first tank was shitty -- but today when the light came on i was at 308 miles -- this is almost as good as i use to have -- about 15 -20 miles less for the tank --- so we will see :)

[acidbbg]

Glad to see that your gas mileage has risen. I have noticed the same thing when i had my CEL!

Chas

[ocd-speed]

I have read through this whole thread. I tried the cel trick on my 2nd gen because i have no rear 02 sensor due to an engine swap. Do you have to have an 02 sensor in the exhaust for it to work? Or can you just leave a sensor hanging. Or can you do it with no 02 sensor at all? I just dont understand how this trick works. Someone finally take the time to explain how this works!! Does it cut the signal from the 02 sensor in half? Does it raise it? What the hell does it do!

[PFUNK5]

yeo dude, look up the thread on the CEL Eliminator Improved...

[99mx5]

Ive done this mod and it seems to work. No CEL during testing. I have the 02 sensor ziptied in my engine compartment. The sensor gets very hot, is this normal? I know its a heated sensor, but I thought the heater was turned on only during warmup.
Thanks!

[99mx5]

Ive done this mod and it seems to work (no CEL). I have the sensor tied up in my engine compartment. This sensor gets really hot, is this normal? I know its a heated sensor, but I thought the heater was on only during warmup.

[codz]

where do you buy the apex kit ? radioshack here didn't have the parts.

[pr5owner]

thats because it acts like a heat sink, the warmth from the engine heats it up, mine did too but its better if you throw it back into the pipe somehwere

[trbomp5]

can someone who has done this AND IT WORKED PERFECTLY for them please post the exact parts used. Ive tried 3x and after about 50 miles its back on again.

Thanks

[dosle]

i dunno what the part #'s were for it all, but heres a pic... i guess you could jot down the markings on the larger part and get that piece, the other smaller ones come in bundles of 5 i think and should be the easiest to find.

this setup pictured has lasted so far 3500 miles and counting.

hope it helps!

[trbomp5]

i dunno what the part #'s were for it all, but heres a pic... i guess you could jot down the markings on the larger part and get that piece, the other smaller ones come in bundles of 5 i think and should be the easiest to find.

this setup pictured has lasted so far 3500 miles and counting.

hope it helps!

Are you just running a header or a turbo? The small part looks like mine. The larger one looks different. I'll go to radioshack tommarow and try to find it.

[dosle]

Are you just running a header or a turbo? The small part looks like mine. The larger one looks different. I'll go to radioshack tommarow and try to find it.
just a header.

the larger part is a beefier piece than needed and it can not be hooked up backwards which was a good safety measure for me.

[trbomp5]

just a header.

the larger part is a beefier piece than needed and it can not be hooked up backwards which was a good safety measure for me.

Maybe thats my prob. Mine might have to be a certain way. Cool thanks for the help.

[Bigg Tim]

If you look back at one of my posts, it has the exact pics of the ones I used. Here they are:

[trbomp5]

If you look back at one of my posts, it has the exact pics of the ones I used. Here they are:
That cap is even different from all the others I've seen. I'll try that too, why not.

[Bigg Tim]

That cap is even different from all the others I've seen. I'll try that too, why not.
Don't know about anybody else, but I have had this combo on since the beginning of the thread and no issues. It has the part numbers you asked for, so this is at least 1 winning combo.

[Pants McGregor]

So, what do people think in terms of the most reliable fix ? The MIL fix or weld a new bung and move the 2nd O2 sensor ?

[acidbbg]

MIL Fix..it's worth a try..and it's dirt cheap! (wink)

[Protege03]

I hate cels.!

[99mx5]

CEL came back on after a while :(
using O2 sim now. Oh well, at least it was worth a try.

[blaxer]

After several unsuccessful attempts with the MIL fix from Apex with my header I finally gave up and went with the spark plug anti-foulers (I think that's what they're called). Been a couple thousand miles now without a CEL and no MIL fix. Wish I had gone with this in the first place so I wouldn't have had to cut my O2 sensor wires.

[DiS]

Chas, Ill be using your instructions in about a week or 2. OBX header! Here I come!

[acidbbg]

Chas, Ill be using your instructions in about a week or 2. OBX header! Here I come!
Dude..it should be cake. If you know how to solder. Your golden. I have used this to pass inspection!

Chas

[DiS]

Dude..it should be cake. If you know how to solder. Your golden. I have used this to pass inspection!

Chas
hah, thats my intention also! NJ inspection blows! I hope im gonna receive my wireless soldering iron before the header...if not then Ill use the regular one, hehe. If not Ill let you do it (peep)

[Shane-O]

CEL came back on after a while :(
using O2 sim now. Oh well, at least it was worth a try.

Me too, Cel came back on after a few days of the dp. I got my emissions a few days before emissions and in VA it's good for two years so I'll be straight for a while.

[DiS]

Me too, Cel came back on after a few days of the dp. I got my emissions a few days before emissions and in VA it's good for two years so I'll be straight for a while.
you mean after you did this CEL eliminator mod, you still had the CEL coming back on? Thats weird, did you get the code out of the ECU?

[acidbbg]

Not sure why some people had problems..and others were golden?

But i know of atleast 2other people that i helped do this..and they had no problems...and have been cel free!

My guess is something to do with the soldering/parts.

[Rism]

When my cel comes on I just reset the ECU and it doesnt come on for another 500 miles. I havent use any type of cel eliminator either

[ZackyFarms]

can someone please elaborate on the other way to do this without citting the wires, using the ant-fouler thing? Blaxer, do u have pics at all? Id prefer not to cut my wires but i will if needed. im getting the obx header off the group buy. Will the spark plug ant-fouler work? i dunno even know where or how this thing would work..im a total newbie to this idea. thanks for any help people!

[trbomp5]

can someone please elaborate on the other way to do this without citting the wires, using the ant-fouler thing? Blaxer, do u have pics at all? Id prefer not to cut my wires but i will if needed. im getting the obx header off the group buy. Will the spark plug ant-fouler work? i dunno even know where or how this thing would work..im a total newbie to this idea. thanks for any help people!

It wont. Simply moving your 02 sensor out of the pipe a little is going to do nothing for eliminating a CEL. That trick is to free up the flow of your exhaust by having the 02 sensor not sticking into the path of the airflow. I have antifoulers on both of my 02 sensors. My 02 sensors are completely out of the flow, back in their own little "pocket".
If antifoulers stopped CEL's then I would not have one would I?

[ZackyFarms]

gotcha, thanks for the quick info...sorry for the dumb Ques.

[blaxer]

It wont. Simply moving your 02 sensor out of the pipe a little is going to do nothing for eliminating a CEL. That trick is to free up the flow of your exhaust by having the 02 sensor not sticking into the path of the airflow. I have antifoulers on both of my 02 sensors. My 02 sensors are completely out of the flow, back in their own little "pocket".
If antifoulers stopped CEL's then I would not have one would I?

Based off personal experience, it does work actually. I had to go this route when I was unable to get the MIL fix to work for me.

[trbomp5]

Based off personal experience, it does work actually. I had to go this route when I was unable to get the MIL fix to work for me.

I guess I dont see how in the world moving your 02 sensor out of the exhaust flow slightly, is going to "trick" it into thinking that all of a sudden the cat is back and the exhaust is all nice and clean now? Its not going to send back the correct milliamps that is made when it is heated up and "sensing" the air / fuel mixture that is unburnt in the exhaust. But if it worked for you, than more power to ya.
There are always unexplained miracles in life. This may be one. Another is that fact that anyone would buy anything made by GM:)

[blaxer]

Yeah, I wish I understood why it is working for me, but I don't. The MIL fix is easy enough to understand why it works, but this I don't know.

Oddly enough, my other vehicle is a GM :)

Edit: Ok just checked the NASIOC board and found some relevant information. The O2 sensor voltage output is directly proportional to the temperature of the filament. By using the anti foulers you effectively remove the filament from the hot exhaust gas flow lowering the filament temperature. When the temperature is reduced the voltage output of the O2 sensor is reduced, simulating the output of the O2 sensor in the exhaust path, with the cat installed.

Here's a link to the thread:
Non-Permanent Mechanical CEL Fix (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=424666)

[trbomp5]

Oddly enough, my other vehicle is a GM :)
I'm really sorry about that.:)

[DiS]

Ok! Finally got my header installed today, and on the way installed the CEL fix, thanks Chas!!! Although, seems like my gas goes away pretty quick!!! Yes I did reset the ECU. I hope my ECU will learn QUICKLY otherwise I will hate myself to fill up every 3 days (as Im driving an hour to my job). Well, Ill see what happens in 2-3 gas tanks.

[acidbbg]

Ok! Finally got my header installed today, and on the way installed the CEL fix, thanks Chas!!! Although, seems like my gas goes away pretty quick!!! Yes I did reset the ECU. I hope my ECU will learn QUICKLY otherwise I will hate myself to fill up every 3 days (as Im driving an hour to my job). Well, Ill see what happens in 2-3 gas tanks.
Congrats(rockon)

The i/h/e does tend to waste more gas. But so is the price for higher hp out of these engines.

Chas

[DiS]

Congrats(rockon)

The i/h/e does tend to waste more gas. But so is the price for higher hp out of these engines.

Chas

NO CHAS!! You just spoiled everything!!!!! (rofl) You have to say that gas milage will be increased! (rofl)

Man, thats bs, I saw my 1st quarter of tank go in freaking 3 hours, not even gunning it all the time.

[acidbbg]

NO CHAS!! You just spoiled everything!!!!! (rofl) You have to say that gas milage will be increased! (rofl)

Man, thats bs, I saw my 1st quarter of tank go in freaking 3 hours, not even gunning it all the time.
Yeah..i know all about it..i had my i/h/e for about 2 months..and the power was def there..but the gas mileage blew.

-Chas

[LI Redline Mp5]

with my mp5 being turboed is it better to just leave the CEL alone seeing how the car tends to run richer this way or will it be better to put in the CEL/MIL eliminator. id rather it run rich then lean

[acidbbg]

with my mp5 being turboed is it better to just leave the CEL alone seeing how the car tends to run richer this way or will it be better to put in the CEL/MIL eliminator. id rather it run rich then lean
Yeah..but if you live in a state like NJ..they will connect to your ODB II and scan it for any codes..and if the cel is on..you will immediatley fail!

Chas

[LI Redline Mp5]

yeah as of oct 20 ny has the same thing so im trying to prepare early for it

[DiS]

Chas! I got a question. Is my milage suppose to suck 1st few days after header install and CEL Fix? Will it ever go up again? I mean, before header was installed, i was doing 212 miles on a HALF of tank. Now I got 180 miles on half of tank. We're talking about SEVERE drop in milage. Shit, I hope its not gonna be like this all the time! Any input?

[acidbbg]

Chas! I got a question. Is my milage suppose to suck 1st few days after header install and CEL Fix? Will it ever go up again? I mean, before header was installed, i was doing 212 miles on a HALF of tank. Now I got 180 miles on half of tank. We're talking about SEVERE drop in milage. Shit, I hope its not gonna be like this all the time! Any input?
Mileage will def suck after you reset the ecu. It causes the computer to relearn maps..So basically it runs richer for first couple hundred miles..than computer leans out the mixture.

How you drive the car will defenitley determine your gas mileage. If you like to stay above 3k rpms..than expect the mileage to plumit fast.

But if you are nice..and shift before 3k You will get better #'s.

Chas

[Horse]

Edit: Ok just checked the NASIOC board and found some relevant information. The O2 sensor voltage output is directly proportional to the temperature of the filament. By using the anti foulers you effectively remove the filament from the hot exhaust gas flow lowering the filament temperature. When the temperature is reduced the voltage output of the O2 sensor is reduced, simulating the output of the O2 sensor in the exhaust path, with the cat installed.

Here's a link to the thread:
Non-Permanent Mechanical CEL Fix (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=424666)

You sir are my HERO!!! Ive been stressing soooo badly about this as my Circuit sports J-pipe is in the mail and I didnt have an O2 "helper"

The scooby guys have the perfect solution - $5 no jibber jabbin with the wiring - nothing that isnt removable - ill be doing this mod when I install my pipe this week - ill let you all know how it works out k?


FAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNTASTIC!! I can wait for this!!!!! (read over the 9 or more pages - there are guys with over 3000 miles - one with over 6K miles and still CEL free!!!)

[Mike R]

I did the spark plug non-fouler fix for 3.97 and no CEL yet. I have 200+ miles on it. Without it the CEL came on in like 20 miles.

[jaburnwo]

I have been reading a lot about the MIL eliminator kit and I have found one on jegs.com, but I am still unsure how you install this part. Would anyone be able to help me out?

[DiS]

I have been reading a lot about the MIL eliminator kit and I have found one on jegs.com, but I am still unsure how you install this part. Would anyone be able to help me out?
which part are u talking about?

[P5 Rally]

dude...
i thought i read somewhere that u can but a MIL eliminator already assembled....i think it was Apex'i....can anyone confirm this

[akProtege5]

after you install the mod when does the cel go away?

[Pants McGregor]

The CEL won't go away, you will need to reset your ECU to clear it. Just disconnect the battery and wait, I think 30 seconds ?

I have about 400km on my car since I installed the mechanical fix and no CEL.

[Horse]

Update:

Ive had the mechanical for over 1200 miles now . . .

Not one problem! I have all sorts of driving on it too, city, freeway. In rain , dry, hold, cold and even snow.

Looks to be the best $2.99 ive ever spent!

[akProtege5]

yea i restarted the ecu, so i'm waiting if the cel comes on. i just hope i did everything ok.

[akProtege5]

the CEL is not coming ON!. Thanks Acidbbg

[ocd-speed]

OK no one ever gives me a clear respone on here. HOW DOES IT WORK WHAT ARE THE PHYSICS? Does the trick take a 1v signal and make it .5v? or What? Also do you have to have an actual oxygen sensor for this to work. Lets say my rear o2 sensor is completely gone, can i hook the rear o2 wires up to the front 02 with this mod in line? Also on a 3rd gen what wire are what, blue is signal return. black are heater? white is signal source?

[Mike R]

You need to wire it with a O2 sensor. It modifies the voltage to be within spec. There is a mechanical fix also. That's what I did. It cost $4 and NO CUTTING!

[CrazyCaker]

The mechnical fix works perfect so far! I've got atleast 1500km since I did it and it works great! (cool)

[joka1]

i have followed this thread to a t and never got it to work, (i am an electrictian on planes and solder all the time) but after 100 miles or so i pop a cell and when i have it read it is for the 2nd o2 sensor... i have been just living with it and dont get worried until my cell starts to flash...... i will take a pic of how mine is setup later to see if anybody can tell me what i did wrong....
rob

[Pheonix]

you can try a different value of resistance. http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=66840

i used a 1M and 4.7M in parallel ~824K seems fine, check out my graphs, doesn't look oem in that nature though

[Kooldino]

Pics of your mechanical fixes??

[Pheonix]

Pics of your mechanical fixes?? nah, just pics of the resulting O2 value graphs
i don't have a stock one to show the difference

edit: here's a pic of my modified O2 sensor, looks kinda discrete

[BaD_HeX]

RadioShack Part #s:
271-1356 :: 1-Megohm Resistors (1/4 watt - 5% tolerance)
272-1055 :: 1.0uF Metalized-Film Capacitor (radial leads 250WVDC max)

UPDATE:
After 144.3 Miles I threw a CEL. Going to try a smaller resistor.

[carbonkid]

subscribe



RadioShack Part #s:
271-1356 :: 1-Megohm Resistors (1/4 watt - 5% tolerance)
272-1055 :: 1.0uF Metalized-Film Capacitor (radial leads 250WVDC max)

UPDATE:
After 144.3 Miles I threw a CEL. Going to try a smaller resistor.

[Replica]

Mine came back on after about 300 miles....

[Pheonix]

reading on...

[Replica]

My gas mileage went to SHIT with the CEL fix...weird....

[MsProtege]

i have followed this thread to a t and never got it to work, (i am an electrictian on planes and solder all the time) but after 100 miles or so i pop a cell and when i have it read it is for the 2nd o2 sensor... i have been just living with it and dont get worried until my cell starts to flash...... i will take a pic of how mine is setup later to see if anybody can tell me what i did wrong....
rob


Have you tried to recet the ecu yet? if not that may help.

[PFUNK5]

by the way guys, Karl here---won't be on all the time--computer is dead, at my uncles house. By resetting the computer via removing the ground on the negative terminal of the battery will only reset the computer, BUT NOT clear the fault code in the computer. Your computers history will still have the fault CEL programmed in. YOu need an OBDII scanner to completely clear out the CEL with the fix.

[DiS]

by the way guys, Karl here---won't be on all the time--computer is dead, at my uncles house. By resetting the computer via removing the ground on the negative terminal of the battery will only reset the computer, BUT NOT clear the fault code in the computer. Your computers history will still have the fault CEL programmed in. YOu need an OBDII scanner to completely clear out the CEL with the fix.

What Karl said about OBDII scanner. You can pick one up at Pepboys. They got 2 or 3 versions. I got the cheapest one (100 US dollars) still works wonders, heh. P.S. My header is off and sold.....

[BaD_HeX]

Riddle me this:

My CEL came on at 144.7 miles (this is with the fix from my previous post). Today, aprox 100 miles later it went off without my changing anything...

[carbonkid]

How come my CEL comes on even though I have a soldered in MIL eliminator? Do they burn out? My o2 sensor (rear one of course) is totally black last time I looked at it (likely normal). I am so sick of this that I might try to return my APEX catless DP and get the catted one. any thoughts? Oh, and I have done the spark plug arrester too, and I still get the code about the rear O2 being weak or no signal.

[carbonkid]

they are called spark plug anti-foulers. i have them on my msp w/ corksport exhaust. use the 18mm ones and just drill out the bottom of one of them with a 1/2" drill bit (do not cut it off) and screw them into each other. it creates a chamber outside the main exhaust fow for the o2 to get a proper reading. suby guys have been doing this for a while with no cel/mil.

I tried this in addition to my MIL elim, had the car reset (batt disconnect, not via OBDII scanner) and I still get "p0140 is no circuit activity detected", WTF!?

I hate CEL/MIL issues, and am considering getting the APEX cat DP, please someone talk me out of this craziness!!

[KpaBap]

You have to use less resistance. Like 750-800k ohms.

[carbonkid]

I tried this in addition to my MIL elim, had the car reset (batt disconnect, not via OBDII scanner) and I still get "p0140 is no circuit activity detected", WTF!?

I hate CEL/MIL issues, and am considering getting the APEX cat DP, please someone talk me out of this craziness!!

I have the prefab MIL Elim from apex, not a homemade one.

[Zivman]

I have the prefab MIL Elim from apex, not a homemade one.


Are you sure you wired it correctly? We installed this on Tom's car (boomergt) and have had ZERO CEL. I have a datalogger that I can run on your car when we come help with the installs tomorrow and we can check what that rear sensor is reading. I have these MIL eliminators one EVERY car I own, the '01 stratus, the '04 Z, and the '98 protege- the protege one I just installed last night and drove about 20 miles on it without an issue. the car isn't modded, the OEM cat just burnt out and now throw codes as a result. The MIL eliminator I wired in was for a WRX/STI and was only a single wire one and it still works.

We'll get your CEL light issues resolved, don't worry!

(this is Tom's buddy Aaron by the way)

[Zivman]

Are you sure you wired it correctly? We installed this on Tom's car (boomergt) and have had ZERO CEL. I have a datalogger that I can run on your car when we come help with the installs tomorrow and we can check what that rear sensor is reading. I have these MIL eliminators one EVERY car I own, the '01 stratus, the '04 Z, and the '98 protege- the protege one I just installed last night and drove about 20 miles on it without an issue. the car isn't modded, the OEM cat just burnt out and now throw codes as a result. The MIL eliminator I wired in was for a WRX/STI and was only a single wire one and it still works.

We'll get your CEL light issues resolved, don't worry!

(this is Tom's buddy Aaron by the way)


If it is a 140 code, it is a bad sensor or bad connection, not an actual catalyst below threshold code. Did you bang up the sensor when you took our/reinstalled it. They are somewhat sensitive and the ceramic inside breaks somewhat easy. I have an extra o2 sensor that we can try if it doesn' seem to be working at all

[boomergt]

Hey John. I think you have one of two problems.

Like Aaron said it could be a bad connection, otherwise when you took the O2 sensor out you could have damaged it.

We will get it taken care of on Saturday.

[carbonkid]

Hey John. I think you have one of two problems.

Like Aaron said it could be a bad connection, otherwise when you took the O2 sensor out you could have damaged it.

We will get it taken care of on Saturday.

sounds good see ya tomorrow....

[nezumi]

My brother has a 03 dodge neon and we just installed his headers in and we first had a cel, but then my friend had a adapter for the O2 sensor. The cel went away

[Nutari]

btw, im at about... 2000 miles and counting with the Spark plug de-fouler O2 mod.. no CEL

[MP503]

i got a questions guys. I got a obx header and got the cel after 100 miles. The 2nd o2 sensor is which one? The one on top or at the bottom of the header?

[carbonkid]

the one closest to the point of combustion is always/ususally #1, so the one at the bottom of your header is #2.i got a questions guys. I got a obx header and got the cel after 100 miles. The 2nd o2 sensor is which one? The one on top or at the bottom of the header?

[Replica]

Oh crap. My soldering sucks, the wire came apart and I've been driving pretty much without a secondary o2 sensor. Lots of black stuff on my exhaust, oddly enough I could reset my ECU and clear the light but it'd come back on at random milage. Car ran like shit, but still beat people, hahah

[carbonkid]

get it fixed? let us know...Oh crap. My soldering sucks, the wire came apart and I've been driving pretty much without a secondary o2 sensor. Lots of black stuff on my exhaust, oddly enough I could reset my ECU and clear the light but it'd come back on at random milage. Car ran like shit, but still beat people, hahah

[cable43]

1300 miles with the non fouler and no cel!!!!!!!!

[ottawaP5]

I just installed the CEL eliminator BUT used a polarized capacitor (plus - minus signs on it). I had a CEL come on after 200 km and was wondering if it was because I used this type of capacitor? I check the soldering and it was all ok. I bought a non polarized capacitor and will install it to see if it will make a difference. What do you guys think?

[cable43]

I just installed the CEL eliminator BUT used a polarized capacitor (plus - minus signs on it). I had a CEL come on after 200 km and was wondering if it was because I used this type of capacitor? I check the soldering and it was all ok. I bought a non polarized capacitor and will install it to see if it will make a difference. What do you guys think?

dude -- GO NON FOULER!!!!!!

CEL......... man- send me $5 and I'll make you one and send it out Saturday Morning!!
(i'm not kidding man PM me if you want)
I'm tired of this BS people need to know that non fouler is the way to go!

[ottawaP5]

dude -- GO NON FOULER!!!!!!

CEL......... man- send me $5 and I'll make you one and send it out Saturday Morning!!
(i'm not kidding man PM me if you want)
I'm tired of this BS people need to know that non fouler is the way to go!

Thanks for the offer, but I'm in the middle of nowhere right now, and have access to a soldering iron, and I need to know if there is a difference between a non polarized and a polarized capacitor. Can someone please let me know?

[Bigg Tim]

Thanks for the offer, but I'm in the middle of nowhere right now, and have access to a soldering iron, and I need to know if there is a difference between a non polarized and a polarized capacitor. Can someone please let me know?

Don't know man. I used the ones in the pics on page 3, they work great. The non-fouler sounds just as good.