How To: EGR Removal and Cleaning, Rough Idle Fix

[122 Vega]

A lot of people have complained about the eratic idle the Protege sometimes gets when the clutch is pushed in and rpms are allowed to fall quickly. The idle will jump anywhere from around 200-1100. This problem seems to get worse when the car warms up. My car started stalling everytime I pushed in the clutch or allowed it to idle. I had to feather it at stops like I was driving one of my old Vegas. Often people would think I was trying to race them because of the revving at the light. So I decided to do something about it.

1. The EGR is located directly below the throttlebody on the 2.0 engine. First remove the upper intake pipe (from IC on MSPs) and you will see it, it has a black circular cap and a grey six pin plug going into it.

http://www.msprotege.com/members/122%20Vega/DSC00155.JPG[/url]

2. The EGR is held on by two 12mm bolts that point up towards the throttlebody. Unplug the EGR and then remove these two bolts. The EGR will come right out. There is a thin metal gasket that may come out with the valve, or it may stay stuck to the mounting pad.

3. This is the valve out of the car. It consists of an electric solenoid attatched to a bypass valve.

http://www.msprotege.com/members/122%20Vega/DSC00157.JPG (http://www.msprotege.com/members/122%20Vega/DSC00155.JPG)

4. Remove the four phillips head screws holding the electric solenoid from the valve body. This will come apart easily.

http://www.msprotege.com/members/122%20Vega/DSC00159.JPG[url="http://www.msprotege.com/members/122%20Vega/DSC00159.JPG"]

5. Clean the inside of the valve assembly completely with a carbon killer of your choice, I prefer Brake-Kleen. I was suprised at the amount of carbon build-up that came out of the valve.

6. Lube the shaft inside with a drop or two of oil and also lube the outside beneath the spring.

7. Reassembly is the reverse of removal. I suggest resetting the PCM while doing this, so the EGR can readjust after you start it.

8. You may want to follow the Manual's suggestion of measuring the resistance of the pins, but my car runs ten times better now, and I have no stalling issues anymore.

9. Time to complete, 30 minutes at most. Good luck.

Britt

[jeffmsp]

you are my fucking hero! time to go clean mine (drive)

[daedalus]

good read. thanks for the detailed pics!

[Spooled]

Wow, I have to try this out. My car has been idling funny for a while, and I've tried everything else. Great post!

[monkeymsp]

How many miles did you guys have on your cars when they started stalling and idling rough?

[Spooled]

I noticed mine start to act funny around 27k miles. I'm at 31k right now and I'm going to take it in to the dealer to check out a couple minor things. I may just have them check the idle issue out at the same time. If it gets warm enough, I'll probably just do it myself. I hate Michigan winters.

[KyRaceFan]

Mine idles rough sometimes, no stalling issues or anything, but i do notice it... i'll check this out when i do the emanage install since the car will be down for a while anyways.

[gboromsp]

I'll try this Monday. My car idles awful. And the rpm's drop low sometimes. I'm also getting awful gas mileage lately. Maybe this will help a bit.

[Kooldino]

I'll give this a go myself when I put my new intake mani on.

Wonder what happens if you totally remove it and make a block off plate? You can leave the EGR connected still and let it suck in ambient air to hopefully not get a CEL.

[spacemonkey]

Fantastic wirte up! Thanks!

This is another common problem with proteges. Im currently experiecing this..its idling around 700-800. So I will do this soon.

mine isnt that bad as it doesnt stall abut you can feel the car shutter and bog sometimes. im at 20K but I noticed it awhile ago.

I always thought it was some kind of mysterious vacumn leak.

[Kooldino]

(moved to "how-to")

[byohndspeed]

so, has anyone else tried this yet?

[Spooled]

5 degrees outside and I don't have a garage. I'm gonna put this on my "to do" list. I bet it will increase gas mileage considerably, too, since we run so rich. A lot of that wasted fuel gets recirculated normally, giving you better economy. I need a heated garage, bad.

[spacemonkey]

I'll try it when I put in thermal spacers and fuel rail/injectors.

[Protege52003]

I had to feather it at stops like I was driving one of my old Vegas. Often people would think I was trying to race them because of the revving at the light. So I decided to do something about it.

Mine was bad for a couple weeks before I realized what it was. My girlfriend hated driving in my car when it was acting up for this reason above. The looks I got from people......great write up here Britt.

Sure many people will use this thread. Thanks.....

-R

[FSDET]

can anyone explain what the egr does and what are the pros and cons of removing it thanks

[Captain KRM P5]

subscribing

[peepsalot]

I don't truly understand everything involved, but I'll take a stab at it. EGR = Exhaust gas recirculation, so basically some of your exhaust is going back into the intake and this is supposed to help emissions by burning fuel that was not burnt the first time around. I was about to say more but I'm drunk and I actually have no idea what i'm talking about. Good day (cool)

[xelderx]

I'm interested in the possibility of blocking off the EGR, but I'm not capable of figuring out what the deal is.

[Dr.Sound]

subscribing

[Spooled]

There is no reason to block or eliminate the EGR valve. The ECU expects it, and I have even heard some very wise people say that it helps fight detonation as a nice side-effect (by displacing some of the mixture and lowering the cylinder temps). You are also helping the environment a lot more than any potential performance you will gain from removing it. A lot of people think that the exaust gases raise the cyninder temps, when in reality it lowers them by displacing some of the A/F mix. You're better off just compressing it a little more and letting the engine burn off more of the "bad stuff".

[ChopstickHero]

great write up. thanks.

[DeadAir]

6. Lube the shaft inside with a drop or two of oil and also lube the outside beneath the spring.
Britt

Nice write-up... what kind of oil are we taking about here? Your standard 3-in-1 that comes in the red & white can or motor oil?

[t3ase]

To anyone that's been keeping up with my car or has seen me recently, you may know that lately, my car has been having large issues starting. When the car ever did start (normally after 13-15 cranks), it may have also stalled right out. I was associating this with the low compression issues.

Well, I tried this today for the hell of it and immediately upon reassembling everything, I went to start the car and it started nearly immediately. The idle also immediately smoothed out and the car did not stall or even try. I turned the car back off and tried it again with the same results, more than once. This helped considerably so far and I'll also vouch on how much buildup came out.

Let me just add that you need a nice quality screwdriver to remove the four screws. They've kind of soft, as the screws to the fuel pump cover are. It takes a bit before they finally "pop" off and start unscrewing, so be sure you do not strip the head out.

Yet another great write up, Vega. Thanks.

[giz]

hey t3ase, when you unscrewed the actual egr valve, what kind of wrench did you use and how did you do it, i dont have the msp (i have a 2.0 ES) but i had almost no room to unscrew it

[t3ase]

hey t3ase, when you unscrewed the actual egr valve, what kind of wrench did you use and how did you do it, i dont have the msp (i have a 2.0 ES) but i had almost no room to unscrew it
12mm wrench. it was extremely tight but a socket wouldn't fit.

[Wiggles422]

Nice write-up... what kind of oil are we taking about here? Your standard 3-in-1 that comes in the red & white can or motor oil?
anyone?
mine is in two pieces as of now... hope 5w-30 works ;)

[122 Vega]

T3ase, glad it worked for you. If the valve is stuck open with deposits, it creates a vacuum leak and that causes the rough idle and stalling.

Yes I used standard motor oil, you could use lithium grease or 3'n'1.

Britt

[dominoy2k1]

clean the red, green, blue or both?
lube red, green, blue or both?

[t3ase]

I cleaned the red with carb cleaner.. Lubed blue with 3n1 there and inside a bit.

[AznXstazy]

im at about 21k and mines been doin it since about 18 or 19 cant remember, but mine idles rough 1min after i start my car everytime thought it was the spark plugs so i hda them replaced it helped like for 20 starts then it started to idle rough again so ill try this when it gets warm down here in va thanks for the how-to!

[PR5Matt]

So has anyone tried removing the EGR tube yet?

[A.V.MSP]

my tube has been disconnected from the manifold for about 600 miles now. I have the spool manifold and it didnt come with a part to screw the egr tube back on. Havent had any problems that I know of

[PR5Matt]

So You Left The Electronics Hooked Up Then. That's What I Needed To Know.

[A.V.MSP]

ya I havent disconnected any plugs. Im thinking of putting a fitting in where the plug goes so I can put an air filter on where the EGR valve sucks air from. Is there any thing wrong with sucking air in that way or should I get a block off plate and remove the EGR valve completely?

[323CiP5]

do you recommend cleaning the egr even if there is no problem? if so how often?

[peepsalot]

Bump for an awesome how to.

I just cleaned mine yesterday, since my car was dipping rpms enough for the dash lights to come on every time I push the clutch in.

After doing this, my car is riding soo much better. It actually seemed to help with a few things.
1. On cold start, my car would bog badly at low rpm, like casually shifting 1st to second, my car would lurk back, and throttle response was badly delayed. This is now gone.
2. My car seems to be less sensitive to lurching back and forth when riding very slowly in 1st or 2nd(traffic jam style cruising).
3. Shifting and rev-matching seems easier than before, I was starting to think I was a shitty driver becuase I couldn't drive this thing smoothly around town, but now I can rev-match again. I guess the rpms are more predicatble or something.
4. Strangely, the one thing it didn't fix was the idle dropping very low, although it may have helped slightly. I have many other mods done that could be to blame for this problem though.

It seems like their is much less drag from the engine when letting off the accelerator, this is probably what helped with points 2 & 3.

I'm hoping my mileage will go up a bit too, but we'll see. I've only taken it for a couple short drives since I did it. I'll keep posted on mileage gains if any.

[aftershock63]

subscribe

[Maxx Mazda]

Just pulled my manifold off to clean EGR and remove VTCS. Will post an update once it's all back together.

[jakemp3surfin]

i wonder if removing the egr tube and spraying some intake cleaner in the hole will help remove build up. i do plan on replacing the tube. i just want to clean out the valve.

[Maxx Mazda]

I'm thinking of removing my tube completely as well. I'll just put a bolt into the hole on the manifold, and have my header welded up. I'll leave all electronics intact.

[ZenProtege]

I don't understand why anybody would want to remove their egr valve. It is a very needed part to your motor! the purpose of it i believe is mainly emissions but it also serves as a sort of safety device for our turbo motors. Its works by recirculating exhaust gas into the intake. The exhaust gas is 'inert" so when it is being put through the combustion chamber it doesn't really do anything but take up space. Recirculating the already burnt gases allows for the motor to put a smaller amount of unburnt air/ fuel into the motor thus keeping temps in the motor down. This could help prevent any pre-ignition tradgedies for our motors as well as making it run more efficiently. I used to have an older car w/ EGR problems so instead of replacing the valve I made some plates and blocked it off. Every time I would pull a big hill I could hear my motor knocking like crazy bc of the valve not being there. Just My .02 cents

[Maxx Mazda]

Anyone know what conditions close the EGR valve? I'll check the FSM later tonight, but just curious.

[jakemp3surfin]

i had a spool turbo kit on my mp3 and it required a closed egr tube. with this set up came a lot of detonation. when i got the wagner kit with an egr bung, i replaced the tube and my car runs better. keep up with the egr valve. it will save your engines!!!!!!

[jcywong]

where is the EGR located on a 1.8L model???

[carbonkid]

subscribe

[Maxx Mazda]

Cleaned my EGR, removed VTCS, oiled EGR well and still have the rough idle. I don't have an MSP, but I thought it might fix my problem after filling up. No go. As far as I can tell, it did next to nothing. It was pretty gummed up, and now it's like fucking CLEAN inside that you could eat off it, but still having rough idle problem...

[carbonkid]

maxx,
how many miles on your plugs?

[Maxx Mazda]

maxx,
how many miles on your plugs?

Changed at 55,000Km, car now has 70,100Km.

[RaiderMP5]

I must finished cleaning my egr. Looked like the one in the 1st pic. Took longer than expected, because the 2 12mm bolts are at a bad angle, and there was a ton of hoses and stuff in the way. Other than that, it went back together quickly. I will know tomorrow if my idle clears up.

Thanks for the how-to!

[RaiderMP5]

Just drove this morning to work. Major improvement on the vibration! i am so glad I did this. Thanks for a great how-to!!!

[MetalSpeed]

Changed at 55,000Km, car now has 70,100Km.

think it may be time to replace them.

[Maxx Mazda]

think it may be time to replace them.

After 15,000Km? That's like 9,000 Miles I think...

[Lord_Zath]

My car just turned 9,000 miles :-D

[b00sted]

can i clean it with engine cleaner? i have something called "Engine Brite"

[RaiderMP5]

can i clean it with engine cleaner? i have something called "Engine Brite"

I would just use a good carb spray and some oil to lube it. I did the cleaning, and it worked. Gunk Engine Brite is a degreaser. It will help on the outside, but not the inside. The carbon buildup I got after 27K was pretty high. Used the steps here, and it worked.

[Nos]

I have 86 000 km and my car started spazzing on idle sometimes . So im gonna get it cleaned . The dealer told me to change it but its quite expensive . I dont get any check engine either . That problem came sorthly after i installed my SRI .

[b00sted]

yea im gonna clean mine this weekend..i just bought 3n1 oil and a carb cleaner

[Wiggles422]

That problem came sorthly after i installed my SRI .
make sure to check around for any vacuum leaks too

[RaiderMP5]

I have 86 000 km and my car started spazzing on idle sometimes . So im gonna get it cleaned . The dealer told me to change it but its quite expensive . I dont get any check engine either . That problem came sorthly after i installed my SRI .

No need to take it to the stealership. It can be cleaned. I found the bolts holding it to the intake to be a bitch to remove, but it is all a matter of the angle you have the ratchet on it. Once te 2 bolts came off, it was 20 minutes tops to clean it and reinstall it.

[Nos]

I looked for leaks but all the connections are nice and tight .

[RaiderMP5]

Then try cleaning it out. You might even want to swap out the plugs for new NGK ones if you have not replaced them in a while. New plugs are cheap.

[GHOSTWHISPER]

Just did this and it feels smoother. But boy oh boy was it built up, I have 42000 on mine. Great write up vega.

[Nos]

I gotta do mine and fast . Its getting worst . spazzed on idle 3-4 times today .

[Maxx Mazda]

I gotta do mine and fast . Its getting worst . spazzed on idle 3-4 times today .

Mine spazzes worse after I cleaned it LOL!

[Nos]

really ?

[peepsalot]

Mine spazzes worse after I cleaned it LOL!
You sure you got a good seal on the two halves? And between the EGR and the manifold? You still have the little metal gasket inbetween the EGR and manifold?

[Maxx Mazda]

Ya, i did it all right, trust me. My fucked idle wasn't due to the EGR is all...

[peepsalot]

well, i can believe if it didn't fix the idle, it didn't fix mine either. I just found it odd that you said it got worse.

[Lord_Zath]

What was it due to then?

[peepsalot]

still not fixed

[Maxx Mazda]

What was it due to then?

Some kind of purge canister solenoid continuium transfunctioner bullshit.... Still does it to this day ever since i bought the car.

[GHOSTWHISPER]

kill it

[RaiderMP5]

I just installed Mobil1 10w30 synthetic and Amsoil tranny fluid. My rough idle problem has completely gone. Although the EGR cleaning helped, it still was rather rough. Now purrs at idle. I would try that if you have not yet.

[Maxx Mazda]

I just installed Mobil1 10w30 synthetic and Amsoil tranny fluid. My rough idle problem has completely gone. Although the EGR cleaning helped, it still was rather rough. Now purrs at idle. I would try that if you have not yet.

I'm using Mobil1 (since I bought the car) and still have the issues.

[RaiderMP5]

Have you taken it in to the dealer to be hooked up to a computer? I am sorry you are having such a fucked up idle. I had it for a few months, drove me crazy.

[Maxx Mazda]

Have you taken it in to the dealer to be hooked up to a computer? I am sorry you are having such a fucked up idle. I had it for a few months, drove me crazy.

It really doesn't bother me that much. I bag the absolute piss out of my car, so I don't expect it to run 100% anyways. Besides, it's only for the 2-3 mins after I fill up with gas then it goes away.

[RaiderMP5]

I wonder if it is a fuel filter issue. I know, I know, it is a 100K filter. But what if it is pretty clogged? The fun thing is, you gotta get to the tank to get the pump out to get to it.

I have a pretty heavy foot, too. I love the fact that unlike my GMC, when I am heavy on the foot, nothing fucking breaks the fuck off (like the driveshaft, seat brackets, alternator, rear end, and others in the first 50K). It has been my best car ever, and I have loved it since day 1.

If you are cool with the idle, then cool. I just wonder how the fresh gas could change things.

[wannabe]

anyone else having a bitch of a time getting those bolts on the bottom out?? i cant get em. my sockets are too deep, and it hits the stuff under it, not allowing me to get on them. my wrenches hit stuff on the sides...its pissing me off (pissed)

[RaiderMP5]

anyone else having a bitch of a time getting those bolts on the bottom out?? i cant get em. my sockets are too deep, and it hits the stuff under it, not allowing me to get on them. my wrenches hit stuff on the sides...its pissing me off (pissed)

I totally had the same problem! I used the ratchet from Sears that was not as thick as a regular ratchet, plus it had a swivel head, helped give me the .000005 of an inch needed to get torque on the nuts. I had to basically pop them loose with a ratchet, and use my fingers to remove them. If you have a magnetic parts tray, I suggest putting it under the EGR when removing them, as it is a pain to reach them if they fall down back there.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000

[wannabe]

hm. i wonder if i can use it once, and then return it :p

[RaiderMP5]

Why? It is an awesome ratchet, and is also good as a breaker bar.

[wannabe]

i have a breaker bar, and a really nice ratchet already...and i'm exceedingly cheap ;)

[RaiderMP5]

Me too. So I only have that one as a breaker bar and a ratchet! In fact, I busted it twice using it as a breaker bar.

[wannabe]

so, in other words, dont use it as a breaker bar ;)

[RaiderMP5]

Yeah you can use it, I have had them for 5 years!

[Nutari]

think us automatic guys would have this same problem? I just noticed like.. last month my car started idling a little funny randomly..

like.. I was sitting in my car listening to sounds.. started the car.. let it sit for a little bit.. then the idle started bouncing a little.. from 800-1200rpms..

should I do the EGR cleaning thing?

[wannabe]

i dont see why you wouldnt have the same problem..the engine is the same, just a different tranny. try it out and let us know.

[Lord_Zath]

Yea the EGR piping goes into the header, which takes exhaust gases coming out of the engine. Nothing a tranny difference will change. Worth a shot!

[marashka]

Great write up, thank you Vega,

[D-rock240]

I'm glad I saw this thread.

I notice the idling problem on my car sporadically. I will be sitting at a light and the tach will randomly drop to 0 for a second and then come back up. While this happens, the car has noticeable vibration and then it's fine after that for a while (although I probably only notice it when I am in the car by myself without the radio on.) However I do have 45,000 miles on it and I bought it two years ago.

I'll try and do it this weekend at my friends shop and I'll post the results. I feel sorry for the uneducated protege owner who will have the dealer "fix" the problem for big bucks.

[tinfoil]

Hey folks!

I believe my car may have this same problem, but it only does it when it is hot and humid outside, and even then it only does it when the engine is cold-ish. Should I have my mechanic clean out the valve? The O2 sensor was replaced about 4-5 weeks ago, if that has anything to do with it.

The car has almost 80,000km on it. Not sure what that translates into miles, but I would assume around 50,000miles.

[RaiderMP5]

don't pay a mechanic to look at it, do the how-to and do it yourself. It is easy (aside fromt he 2 bastard bolts holding it to the manifold.

[kasmankk]

jsut to share something about idleing problem. I have this problem also. I did the egr valve cleaning. it did not help. I guess because it was not clogged. Next i took out the idle solenoid valve, guess what???? the plunger was stuck and couldn't open the air passage when energized. I cleanned the carbon build up (i guess from EGR) with carb cleaner and brass brush. Idling is better now.

(cool)
Hey folks!

I believe my car may have this same problem, but it only does it when it is hot and humid outside, and even then it only does it when the engine is cold-ish. Should I have my mechanic clean out the valve? The O2 sensor was replaced about 4-5 weeks ago, if that has anything to do with it.

The car has almost 80,000km on it. Not sure what that translates into miles, but I would assume around 50,000miles.

[RaiderMP5]

idle solenoid? Want to show us pics>? It might help us all.

[tinfoil]

don't pay a mechanic to look at it, do the how-to and do it yourself. It is easy (aside fromt he 2 bastard bolts holding it to the manifold.

Oh, I was thinking about it and I do have the necessary tools, but I must admit to being a little... unsure of myself. Sure, I'll replace an alternator or just about anything else on my old 67 Wildcat, but the engine bay on that car is large enough to house a small family and doesn't have all the hoses, wires and computer gibblets.

*sigh*

Time to man up, I suppose ;>

jsut to share something about idleing problem. I have this problem also. I did the egr valve cleaning. it did not help. I guess because it was not clogged. Next i took out the idle solenoid valve, guess what???? the plunger was stuck and couldn't open the air passage when energized. I cleanned the carbon build up (i guess from EGR) with carb cleaner and brass brush. Idling is better now.


I did forget to mention that my CEL came on and the code is for the EGR valve. Oh, and where is this idle solenoid?

[kasmankk]

I'll take some photos tomorrow morning, if still needed. You going to need a special torx wrench to take the valve out. Clean the plunger and the housing.

check out the pics. In my case, when i removed the solenoid valve, the plunger got stock to the throttle body. There was carbon build up.

idle solenoid? Want to show us pics>? It might help us all.

[tinfoil]

Well Well!

I cleaned my EGR and idle solenoid (since I was already in there, why not). Sure enough, the plunger bit was indeed hanging up and causing my problems. Luckily, a mechanic buddy of mine was available to watch over me, which was good because there were some problems. Of course, it came out easily, but pulling it apart turned out to be a chore. Pulling the valve apart, even after letting some penetrating fluid work on it for an hour, resulted in one stripped screw and one sheared screw. Ah well, luckily my mechanic friend has a full shop so we drilled and tapped all the holes and put in new screws.

But, it's all done and it works MUCH better now. Thanks for the How-To!

[turbodcee]

You are the man!! My car has 50,150 miles on it and it wouldnt idle. The delear wouldnt value my expired warranty by 150 miles! I cleaned the sticky , carbonated valve and voila, it idles smother that ever.

I am beginning to hate Mazda service! They have yet to satisfy any of my requests.

[otmsp]

This really works well!!!! My ride idles so much better ....Thanx... (first)

[falsedawn]

Don't for one minute think this is a "30 minute" job though.
Just getting to the bolts involves removing the intake duct and various plugs and pipes and stuff.
Then you'll find the bolts are all but inaccessible to anybody with normal sized hands, and the throttle cable baulks access even more, precisely at the angle you need to get the spanner on.

Once you manage to wriggle a spanner over the bolt heads, you'll find they are bolted in tighter than a camel's arse in a sandstorm.
If you manage to pull the damn EGR valve off without losing any of the bolts/metal gasket, you'll probably need to soak it in penetrating fluid for an hour before attempting to undo the screws that hold it togehter, since these apparently are made of cheese and disintegrate at the first sign of torque.

Once cleaned and oiled, getting it back on is just as bad - I suggest one of those "grabbers" for when bolts and bits go flying into the nether regions of the engine compartment.

They give torque settings for the bolts, but there's barely the room to swing a mini-ratchet, let alone a torque wrench. I say just do them up as tight as you can with a spanner.

Total time to complete: 4 hours.
Total skinned knuckles: all of them
Total time wasted trying to fish out dropped bits from the engine: 1 hour
Total profanities uttered: Lots

Maybe I should just stick to my day job and let the grease monkeys handle this sort of stuff...

[122 Vega]

Don't for one minute think this is a "30 minute" job though.
Just getting to the bolts involves removing the intake duct and various plugs and pipes and stuff.
Then you'll find the bolts are all but inaccessible to anybody with normal sized hands, and the throttle cable baulks access even more, precisely at the angle you need to get the spanner on.

Once you manage to wriggle a spanner over the bolt heads, you'll find they are bolted in tighter than a camel's arse in a sandstorm.
If you manage to pull the damn EGR valve off without losing any of the bolts/metal gasket, you'll probably need to soak it in penetrating fluid for an hour before attempting to undo the screws that hold it togehter, since these apparently are made of cheese and disintegrate at the first sign of torque.

Once cleaned and oiled, getting it back on is just as bad - I suggest one of those "grabbers" for when bolts and bits go flying into the nether regions of the engine compartment.

They give torque settings for the bolts, but there's barely the room to swing a mini-ratchet, let alone a torque wrench. I say just do them up as tight as you can with a spanner.

Total time to complete: 4 hours.
Total skinned knuckles: all of them
Total time wasted trying to fish out dropped bits from the engine: 1 hour
Total profanities uttered: Lots

Maybe I should just stick to my day job and let the grease monkeys handle this sort of stuff...


This is a 30 minute job for the average person that understands the whole "righty-tighty, lefty-loosey" thing should be able to tackle it without problem.

Sorry about the whole gravity issue as well.

Britt

[RaiderMP5]

I had a similiar experience, but it took about 1.5 hours for me. The screws being made of cheese is funny as hell! I did not have camel ass tight bolts holding on the EGR valve. Mine were torqued at the factory to "payback for Hiroshima".I used a Craftsman swivel head wrench, which is thinner than a regular ratchet. It still took a bit to loosen them. I put my magnetic parts tray under the EGR to catch the bolts and metal gasket the many times they fell during reinstall. This is the wrench I used. It has a long handle, but being able to angle the ratchet head helped. http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000

http://content.sears.com/data/product_images/009/44815/00944815000-190.jpg

[wannabe]

This is a 30 minute job for the average person that understands the whole "righty-tighty, lefty-loosey" thing should be able to tackle it without problem.

Sorry about the whole gravity issue as well.

Britt

no. i agree. i work on my car all the time and this was actually a pretty difficult task. after going back out and buying a little lowprofile breaker bar i was able to get the bolts off, but then even AFTER soaking the screws in liquid wrench i still stripped 2 of the 4 screws and couldnt get them out AT ALL. i ended up just spraying the cleaner into the valve with the electronics still on there. i let it dry thoroghly before putting it back on, but i still didnt get all the crap out that it should have because i could only do half. it took me a little over an hour.

i did not have the gravity problem.

[122 Vega]

Hmm, I guess I stand corrected then. Maybe I got lucky.

Britt

[122 Vega]

I'll take some photos tomorrow morning, if still needed. You going to need a special torx wrench to take the valve out. Clean the plunger and the housing.

check out the pics. In my case, when i removed the solenoid valve, the plunger got stock to the throttle body. There was carbon build up.

BTW, thanks for adding this, this was to be the next addition to this How-To but you did it for me.

Britt

[tinfoil]

Half hour, if your lucky perhaps. If I didn't have the watchful eye or a mechanic looking over things, then I probably would have had to tow the car in. That being said, if I had been more careful, I probably wouldn't have busted off one of the screws and had to tap the entire thing out.

NOw, the guy who was helping me out is a diesel mechanic. He pointed out that EGR valves in the typical really-big-trucks that he works on actually have the plunger inside rotating a little bit each time it activates, helping it to rid itself of some carbon buildup. Not a bad idea at all.

[Voltaic]

Damn, I wish I had seen this thread before I got it fixed.

My CEL turned on while going to Mazda for my 72,000KM maintenance!

Reading ODB-II codes: 60$
Replacing EGR Valve: 195$
Laybor: 75$ / hour

So, close to 380$ CAD

I'm going to build myself an ODB-II reader so that I can avoid spending a crazy amount of money on something I could have done myself. :'(

[PaulMP3]

I'll give this a go myself when I put my new intake mani on.

Wonder what happens if you totally remove it and make a block off plate? You can leave the EGR connected still and let it suck in ambient air to hopefully not get a CEL.

i did this this past weekend. After about 60miles the CEL came back on.

[Kooldino]

Damn...so it was sucking in ambient air and it still tripped a CEL?

[bigj884]

will cleaning the egr valve do anything for an auto P5??

do auto P5's even have egr valves???

[Lord_Zath]

yes and yes

[AVP]

Thanks for the write-up 122 vega! I just removed the egr on my gf's protege.

I have a question though, should the spring be able to compress really easy?

When I push on the spring, it opens the valve inside the housing, but the valve gets stuck there in the open position (it was opened when i took it apart). Then I have to pull on the spring to get it to close the valve (or wedge a screw driver on the top of the valve).

I have already sprayed carbon cleaner inside there, and sprayed silicone lubricant in there aswell while trying to work the spring back and fourth. But it only wants to stay either open or closed.

Could the valve be trashed? This can't be how it should be right?

Any replies would be appreciated!!
-Ash

[122 Vega]

It should not "stick" in either position. It should stay closed without the solenoid activated. The spring is pretty weak, but is strong enough to close the valve if it is clean. I would suggest soaking the shaft of the valve with some PB Blaster or 3'n'1 penatrating oil for awhile. then see what happens.

Britt

[AVP]

Thanks britt,

Yeah I brought it to work and showed someone who is familiar with cars, he said the valve is probably fubar'd.

But since I have PB blaster, I am soaking it right now (like you suggested), see if it does anything.

If that doesn't work and the thing is hosed, anyone know of any good Mazda parts sites?
I found one on this site for $124. I was thinking of calling autozone for giggles aswell.
http://www.mazda-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm

[peepsalot]

Thanks britt,

Yeah I brought it to work and showed someone who is familiar with cars, he said the valve is probably fubar'd.

But since I have PB blaster, I am soaking it right now (like you suggested), see if it does anything.

If that doesn't work and the thing is hosed, anyone know of any good Mazda parts sites?
I found one on this site for $124. I was thinking of calling autozone for giggles aswell.
http://www.mazda-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm
I have found www.car-part.com (http://www.car-part.com) to be very good in helping me find parts, although it seems EGR is not one of the things you can search for. (yupnope)

[AVP]

peep-
Yeah, sucks that site doesn't list egr valve, and it has nothing in the emissions section either. Thanks though.

Anyhow, I let it sit in pb blast 3 times and carbon cleaner twice. Now I am able to push on the spring with out it getting stuck. I had to work it a lot for this to happen though. I think it will eventually get stuck again, but hopefully I can squeeze 10k miles out of it before it gunks up again (monkey2)
Good thing it wasn't that hard for me to remove since my ratchet set includes a small handle.

-Ash

[122 Vega]

EGR is covered under an extended emissions warranty. If it is bad then put it back together and go get a new one. They apparently were on backorder for awhile because they were being replaced so often.

Britt

[peepsalot]

NOw, the guy who was helping me out is a diesel mechanic. He pointed out that EGR valves in the typical really-big-trucks that he works on actually have the plunger inside rotating a little bit each time it activates, helping it to rid itself of some carbon buildup. Not a bad idea at all.
That would be sweet if some kind of replacement like that could be fitted to our cars.

[shugalou]

Great how too! I did this on my wifes car and she says that it has totally smoothed out! I called the stealer ship and they wanted 194.55 for the valve adn 7.11 for the gasket and .5 hour labour. So I saved about 250 bucks.

A couple of tips to pass on.

1. on the 1.8 motor the EGR Valve was behind the throttle body not underneath.

2. A small rachet and 12mm socket gets in there fine.

3. If the "swiss cheese" screws strip a pair of Vice Grips easily gets them off, I had one strip on me, probably easier to use vice grips anyways cause you reduce the chance of stabing yourself philips style.

4. Use throttle body cleaner. I used half a can of my Honda brake cleaner and I could still see a ton of carbon but it wasn't breaking up. I went to CT and bought the motomaster TB cleaner for 8 bucks and then it started to take off the carbon, more than ever seen with the brake cleaner, this is a must if there is a ton of build up. I used almost the full can of this before the liquid coming out of the EGR was clear!

5. While you have the intake hose off, use the TB cleaner to actually clean the TB, you'll need someone to open the throttle though as it kept dying on me when I tried it myself.

Thanks for this tip, and the great picts!

[hopeful]

i just did this and i think it took like 30-45mins, anyways mine was STUCK wide open, and for a while i've been having idle problems (thought it was the IAC, even cleaned it a few days ago) This explains alot to me.

Bought car at 68K, replaced rod bearings at 70K-- over revving/detonation, but engine was detonating (I only heard it when i turned the radio down) prev owner put in bosch plat4s!. --put in NGK alot of it was gone (stil a toiny bit remained) couldnt get rid of it but im sure having an operational egr will help.

btw, i dont recommend putting oil on the valve anywhere, it''ll burn and become a deposit (how do you think the deposits on there now got there?)

btw, anyone else here also run straight 30wt? (sick)

[AceProtege]

great thread......just cleaned my valve!

[hopeful]

it fixed it, the check engine light even went away on its own, awesome thread. (first)

[AceProtege]

yeah, my car runs super smooth right now.....this will be a half year service for my car now.......

[fLyPiNoY7]

just cleaned mine and my idle is a whole lot better!...had some issues reinstalling the bolts due to all the hoses blocking the path of the ratchet, but that was quickly solved by switching to my smaller ratchet...all in all, it took me 3 hours to do, but most of that was waiting for my dad to get back from the parts store with intake cleaner and me also performing the throttle body bypass mod...btw, where do you get the torx wrench to remove the iac?...looks like it needs to be hollow...

[P-Funk!]

^What is the 'Throttle Body Bypass Mod' you mention?

Thankx.

[A.V.MSP]

you disconnect the coolant lines from the TB and just connect them together so hot coolant doesnt go through the TB and heat up the air

[prostylez]

just did mine... the fluctuating rpm drop has vanished... great write up.. thx for the help. (thumb)

[wannabe]

you disconnect the coolant lines from the TB and just connect them together so hot coolant doesnt go through the TB and heat up the air

(pics)

[Erci]

My car was running fine (23k with zero problems), so I did this "just because".
Sure enough, it idles smoother now, so I'm happy :D
Definitely not a 30 minute job unless you're a pro mechanic or if you've done it before. I *could* probably do it in 30 minutes now, but it took me a hell of a lot longer to figure it all out the first time.
Mostly problems accessing screws/bolts. They ARE all made of cheese and I didn't have the special (hollow) torx wrench, so I had to use vice-grips with very little room to swing'em.

[Erci]

Forgot to mention.. I couldn't clean the throttle body the conventional way (pulling intake off and spraying throttle body cleaner past the butterfly while keeping rpm's up. The car would start and immediately die, no matter how high I'd try to get the rpm's up right after start.
Anyone do this successfully?

[peepsalot]

Forgot to mention.. I couldn't clean the throttle body the conventional way (pulling intake off and spraying throttle body cleaner past the butterfly while keeping rpm's up. The car would start and immediately die, no matter how high I'd try to get the rpm's up right after start.
Anyone do this successfully?
You can't run the engine with the intake off, you need that MAF there. Clean the throttle body with the engine off.

[kipper88]

This how/to kicks ass...thanks

edit to say: if i can do it, any dumbass w/ a screw driver can do it.

[Dr.Sound]

did it make a difference?

[wannabe]

i have a quick update for this thread as far as my idle problems go. i had been having issues with the car idling low, and even stalling, when i cleaned the EGR it made a difference for the next couple starts, but then went right back to stalling and spluttering.

i have since cleaned it again, soaking it with the cleaner for a long period of time, i guess the last time i did it i didnt torque the bolts all the way down because one of them was missing (boom07), so i replaced that bolt, i have also replaced the pcv, ran seafoam through the vacuum lines and gas tank, and reset the ECU. since then it has been running wonderfully with no issues yet. i did this all a couple weeks ago, and have driven over 1000 miles since doing it. apparently my issues are better, hopefully for good now.

[L8R]

It seems to me like our cars need a lot of maintanence. Does Mazda point these issues out? Or is this normal maintanence?

[Titanium-99]

awesome info! i think im going to do this today

[chowhoundMSP]

everyone else is doing it, guess i should try it as well

peer pressure!

[carbonkid]

me too! lol!

[hopeful]

I can imagine this only happens to people who beat on their motors more. the carbon build up comes from excess hydrocarbons in the exhaust, either unburnt fuel (most likely coming from WOT situations) or even worse, burning oil.

i bet grandmas driving the auto p5's dont get this problem at all. I'm a firm beleiver in that I cause all my own vehicle problems.

[L8R]

Kinda sucks, seems like I'm the only one who got problems with the AC. Kinda wierd... I cleaned like how it said to!

Peace

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123618087

[Protege52003]

I can imagine this only happens to people who beat on their motors more. the carbon build up comes from excess hydrocarbons in the exhaust, either unburnt fuel (most likely coming from WOT situations) or even worse, burning oil.

i bet grandmas driving the auto p5's dont get this problem at all. I'm a firm beleiver in that I cause all my own vehicle problems.

throwing all those CEL's and everything for doing crazy stuff with our cars.....

i cleaned mine last month and it was sooooo bad after many CEL's and stuff......

i had mazda throw a new one in at 30K (TSB) and I was around 51K when this one got bad........

cleaned her and she runs great now........

-R

[clicknext]

What's considered rough idle? Mine idles around 700-800, and fluctuates a little bit, but not too much. The idle does seem a bit low, not high enough to minimize vibration while idling, but it doesn't make any sudden large changes.

I'm thinking about doing this just for the hell of it while I'm slowly doing the 30k maintenance one item at a time, but I'm a total car newbie. Most extensive work I'v done is change spark plugs. Generally pretty good with small mechanical/electrical stuff, but I've gotta ask a few stupid questions:
1) Where/what is the throttle body? (Where should I look on this picture (http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/MazdaProtege5/Images/Engine.jpg))
2) What needs to be taken off before I can get at the valve?

[Lord_Zath]

on the engine, follow the intake manifold (the piece of metal coming out of the car facing the rear) and follow the stock intake pictured (the piece of black plastic coming into the intake manifold). Where the two meet and have a party is the throttle body.

[Protege52003]

What's considered rough idle? Mine idles around 700-800, and fluctuates a little bit, but not too much. The idle does seem a bit low, not high enough to minimize vibration while idling, but it doesn't make any sudden large changes.



this idle is normal.....if the EGR valve is really dirty and getting stuck open when engine is fully warmed your idle will go down to around 300-500 and eventually not even idle.......

[RaiderMP5]

benzete has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - How To: EGR Removal and Cleaning, Rough Idle Fix - in the How-To forum of Mazda Forums.

This thread is located at:
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=94788&goto=newpost

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
man those bolts are impossible to get to, gonna try home depot or sears on the weekend and get a small ratchet and try again possibly. Not to mention for some reason i had problems getting the plug out, whether it was my own stupidity or because the button didnt have much play. Actually, (too lazy to backspace) since i'm going taking it to Nick's shop on friday i'll just have him do it.


Not sure why the post is gone. Either way, I used this ratched to break those SOB bolts loose.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000&subcat=Ratchets


(http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/catalog/product/imgLayoutCol.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&imgPath=%2Fdata%2Fproduct_images%2F009%2F44815%2F0 0944815000-dlv.jpg&prdName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex+ Head&itemNo=00944815000&manuModelNo=44815&pid=00944815000&swatch=%3A&prodName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex +Head&s7Names=NoS7Images%3A&s7Path=%2Fis%2Fimage%2FSears%2F00944815000%3A)

[hopeful]

What's considered rough idle? Mine idles around 700-800, and fluctuates a little bit, but not too much. The idle does seem a bit low, not high enough to minimize vibration while idling, but it doesn't make any sudden large changes.

I'm thinking about doing this just for the hell of it while I'm slowly doing the 30k maintenance one item at a time, but I'm a total car newbie. Most extensive work I'v done is change spark plugs. Generally pretty good with small mechanical/electrical stuff, but I've gotta ask a few stupid questions:
1) Where/what is the throttle body? (Where should I look on this picture (http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/MazdaProtege5/Images/Engine.jpg))
2) What needs to be taken off before I can get at the valve?


it starts out this way, and progressively gets worse, you'll notice the engine not being able to keep a steady pace while driving soon, then the stalling starts happening, clean it now it'll only help anyways.

[smo0f]

Haha, thanks. I think I was drunk and deleted it. I'm looking around the thread this morning swearing I posted something, went nuts for a bit.



Not sure why the post is gone. Either way, I used this ratched to break those SOB bolts loose.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000&subcat=Ratchets


(http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/catalog/product/imgLayoutCol.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&imgPath=%2Fdata%2Fproduct_images%2F009%2F44815%2F0 0944815000-dlv.jpg&prdName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex+ Head&itemNo=00944815000&manuModelNo=44815&pid=00944815000&swatch=%3A&prodName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex +Head&s7Names=NoS7Images%3A&s7Path=%2Fis%2Fimage%2FSears%2F00944815000%3A)

[Protege52003]

Not sure why the post is gone. Either way, I used this ratched to break those SOB bolts loose.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000&subcat=Ratchets


(http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/catalog/product/imgLayoutCol.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&imgPath=%2Fdata%2Fproduct_images%2F009%2F44815%2F0 0944815000-dlv.jpg&prdName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex+ Head&itemNo=00944815000&manuModelNo=44815&pid=00944815000&swatch=%3A&prodName=Craftsman+3%2F8+in.+Drive+Ratchet%2C+Flex +Head&s7Names=NoS7Images%3A&s7Path=%2Fis%2Fimage%2FSears%2F00944815000%3A)

i used the same thing.....those were a PITA to get at.....i did mine at night, too with not much light......outside and cold too!

[pacmanmp5]

how tha heck did youget the 12 mm bolts undone. i can't fit anything in there.

[RaiderMP5]

I hat the adjustable head on the ratchet at like 45 degrees,a nd just jad to find the 1% of free play to get it to pop loose just one click. Then slowly work it out. It is a PIA, even if the bolts are not rusty.

[hellcat]

Subscribing, I have 62k miles on my car. Idles and runs rough. I will let you guys know how it works for me. Great how to by the way.

[Kansei]

I think I'll be doing this again tomorrow afternoon while I'm under the hood anyway doing my timing belt. When I removed my CAI and installed my SRI last weekend I took the EGR valve off to clean it just for the hell of it. At nearly 59k miles my idle was smooth as could be (after removing the AWR front motor mount) but with everyone saying they needed it at 20-30k and with the way I drive my car, I thought it couldn't hurt.

I stripped three of the 4 screws to separate the two parts of the valve, so I just tried spraying brake cleaner in through the two holes.. a fair bit of dirty stuff came out, I just kept spraying until it got clear. I put it back in, and ... well now my idle sucks.

At first it was just idling a bit low, but now if I ever take the car up above 4k RPM and disengage the clutch it will stall on command. It idles at 500 RPM when warmed up and all my in car electronics dim, including the horrible beeping wrath of my Beltronics radar detector warning me about low voltage.

I'll give it a go tomorrow by letting it soak in the pb blaster for a good hour while I'm working on the timing belt and then I'll use vice grips to pry that sucker apart. I'll try to remember to buy some "throttle body cleaner" too, and hopefully I can find a place with NGK plugs since I last replaced mine at 27 or 30k.

[wannabe]

I think I'll be doing this again tomorrow afternoon while I'm under the hood anyway doing my timing belt. When I removed my CAI and installed my SRI last weekend I took the EGR valve off to clean it just for the hell of it. At nearly 59k miles my idle was smooth as could be (after removing the AWR front motor mount) but with everyone saying they needed it at 20-30k and with the way I drive my car, I thought it couldn't hurt.

I stripped three of the 4 screws to separate the two parts of the valve, so I just tried spraying brake cleaner in through the two holes.. a fair bit of dirty stuff came out, I just kept spraying until it got clear. I put it back in, and ... well now my idle sucks.

At first it was just idling a bit low, but now if I ever take the car up above 4k RPM and disengage the clutch it will stall on command. It idles at 500 RPM when warmed up and all my in car electronics dim, including the horrible beeping wrath of my Beltronics radar detector warning me about low voltage.

I'll give it a go tomorrow by letting it soak in the pb blaster for a good hour while I'm working on the timing belt and then I'll use vice grips to pry that sucker apart. I'll try to remember to buy some "throttle body cleaner" too, and hopefully I can find a place with NGK plugs since I last replaced mine at 27 or 30k.

sounds like its not torqued back in all the way. i had a screw fall out of mine and it idled like crap...

[Protege52003]

I
I stripped three of the 4 screws to separate the two parts of the valve, so I just tried spraying brake cleaner in through the two holes.. a fair bit of dirty stuff came out, I just kept spraying until it got clear. I put it back in, and ... well now my idle sucks.

i used vice grips to get two of mine off......
stripped them....

-r

[Kansei]

sounds like its not torqued back in all the way. i had a screw fall out of mine and it idled like crap...

At the time it felt like it was torqued down as much as it was before. I'll find out this afternoon though. Thanks

[Kansei]

At the time it felt like it was torqued down as much as it was before. I'll find out this afternoon though. Thanks

Everything was nice and tight. I went at it with Gumout Throttle Body Cleaner and put it back in, and while I was under the hood ripped out the NGK Iridiums that look toasted and put NGK V-Power (under 2 dollars each) in.

Idles like the first time I ever drove it now.

Oh and the gasket on the EGR.. is it likely that it is fused onto my intake manifold? Of course I can't see the intake manifold side of the mounting surface but feeling around with my hand it didn't feel like there was any gasket there.

Maybe I'll order one from the stealership and next time I'm under there I'll replace it. I'll just stick it in my large box of OEM parts I need to replace when I get the chance. I even ordered an OEM oil drain plug washer because my car is still rocking the original.

[wannabe]

how much was the oem drain plug gasket? the tools at autozone can't ever get me the right one...

[Kansei]

how much was the oem drain plug gasket? the tools at autozone can't ever get me the right one...

Yeah I tried Advance Auto Parts and they gave me one with a PLASTIC washer. For some reason it didn't click with me that it would melt and I leaked a bit of oil the next day. I think the OEM one was like a dollar, I don't remember the name of the web site where I got it it's just some parts web site that has all sorts of OEM and generic replacement parts.

[hellcat]

Took about an hour for me to complete this task. Never attempted it before. There was quite a bit of carbon built up inside. The valve and spring was still sitting well and the spring mechanism wasn't sticking. I will try to clean the throttle solenoid next when I get the little star tool it takes to remove the thing.

[Kansei]

Found the site http://www.thepartsbin.com/

Bought my timing belt, drain plug washer, some nice winter floor mats, and a few other random replacement parts from there.

[wannabe]

thanks for the link. appreciate it.

do you remember which one you got?

http://oem.thepartsbin.com/parts/thepartsbin/wizard.jsp?year=2001&make=MA&model=PRO--005&category=All&part=Oil%20Drain%20Plug%20Gasket&dp=true

[Protege52003]

Found the site http://www.thepartsbin.com/

Bought my timing belt, drain plug washer, some nice winter floor mats, and a few other random replacement parts from there.

great find chris.....

wow, timing belt is more than i thought!
did you change yous yet?

-R

[cbcbd]

Thanks for the how-to.
I cleaned my EGR valve and it solved my almost stalling issues at idle.

I cleaned it the first time with tons of Carb cleaner and a brush... but it didn't solve it.
Only then I realized that the valve was probably stuck and I never checked it...
so I took it off again and when I pushed the valve in it just stuck open until I pulled it back. I cleaned the hell out of it with more carb cleaner and PB blaster while pushing the valve in and out until it would close on it's own and move pretty smoothly. Lubed it up with some oil and put it back. It's been perfect since.

[Bijou-MP5]

I have auto p5.
recently, I was having problem with misfiring and found out that one of coil pack was malfunctioning. replaced the coil pack, plugs, and wires today and test drove them, it was great until my car stalled when I was at stop sign.
I was checking out the idle, it was really low, it stays on 500 rpm and drops close to 100rpm.
I guess it's time for me to clean EGR valve and PCV valve.
I will let u know if this solves my low idle problem

Update ***
Replaced the PCV valve
Cleaned the EGR valve but I don't think mine can be cleaned...there were alot of carbons build up in there(70000miles on my car) it was hard to remove them.
Seafoamed fue tank...no luck
I did everything but still gives me low idle...
let me show you guys picture... I think it's pretty low..

[Lord_Zath]

Chris, that's actually where the idler is set for the automatic. I asked my dealer about this as well - 600-800 rpm idle is the norm for auto's after being warmed up.

[Bijou-MP5]

Chris, that's actually where the idler is set for the automatic. I asked my dealer about this as well - 600-800 rpm idle is the norm for auto's after being warmed up.

really? that relieves me little..but my rpm is at about that level when it's parked and when it's in drive mode it drops 1 line below.
:( if it was just low idle then I wouldn't really mind but my engine tried to stall when I was at parking lot and when I was at stop sign...
do you know if EGR valve is covered under emission warranty(80k)? and how do you read rpm below 1K?

[ghost]

Exelent How-to!!!! It would have saved my P5.

[Lord_Zath]

really? that relieves me little..but my rpm is at about that level when it's parked and when it's in drive mode it drops 1 line below.
:( if it was just low idle then I wouldn't really mind but my engine tried to stall when I was at parking lot and when I was at stop sign...
do you know if EGR valve is covered under emission warranty(80k)? and how do you read rpm below 1K?

I'm not sure about the answer to that question. I would think since it's part of the emissions system that it was...

My idle is lower with the car in drive than with the car sitting in park as well. If it's trying to die, I would seriously get that EGR valve looked at.

[Bijou-MP5]

I'm not sure about the answer to that question. I would think since it's part of the emissions system that it was...

My idle is lower with the car in drive than with the car sitting in park as well. If it's trying to die, I would seriously get that EGR valve looked at.

thanks, I will be in chicago this week and probably drop the car at dealer for egr replacement(any recommendation for dealer?).
btw, when I looked at my egr valve, two holes were all black and one of them were covered with about 1/6 of carbon stuff. but I couldn't get rid of all of them.

[Lord_Zath]

Rosen Mazda in Lake Villa would be my top choice. Their Waukegan branch is good as well. Though they're in the suburbs :).

[Kansei]

Chris, that's actually where the idler is set for the automatic. I asked my dealer about this as well - 600-800 rpm idle is the norm for auto's after being warmed up.

But 500-600 on a manual tranny car... and if I rev it when the RPMs drop they drop too low and it stalls.

*crosses fingers* it hasn't done it in the past week after re-cleaning the EGR.

[scott42]

Great write up- I'll be doing this tonight and will post results afterwards. (60,800 miles on car-this will be the first cleaning) My symptoms are spot on with most of this thread.
Thanks Britt :)

[Kansei]

Great write up- I'll be doing this tonight and will post results afterwards. (60,800 miles on car-this will be the first cleaning) My symptoms are spot on with most of this thread.
Thanks Britt :)

Is your idle rough? If it's still smooth it might not be worth doing. Mine was smooth at 66k before I cleaned it. It's a simple job but that doesn't mean it's easy. The bolts are sorta a pain in the ass to get to.

If you go ahead and do it make sure you spray down the 4 screws holding the two pieces together with PB blaster. I ended up having to use vice grips on 3 of them because they stripped so easily.

[scott42]

Nope- I'm having issues :) http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2183007#post2183007

[scott42]

*rod roddy from the price is right voice* "A New CAR!"

It worked and worked well. Took around an hour from popping the hood to starting back up with 2 people (one holding light)
Symptoms prior to taking anything apart:
-poor idle, low, weak, rough
-poor acceleration, dropping rpms @ shifts
-terrible mileage (approx <20mpg)

What we saw when we opened it up:
-spring completely dry and getting stuck in either up or down position
-what looked like awful corrosion (like a decintigrated (sp?) gasket) around the base of the spring, but i figure is the carbon buildup referenced here
>>cleaned the crap, lubed the spring, reset ecu - didn't see too much 'stuff' in any of the tubes, just surrounding the spring
Results:
-better, VERY stable idle
-faster/smoother/quieter throttle response
-greatly improved mileage (I think I got about 20-30 miles out of the last quarter tank before doing this)
-smoother, more powerful acceleration

Another donation for the forum is in order!

[Bijou-MP5]

EGR is covered under an extended emissions warranty. If it is bad then put it back together and go get a new one. They apparently were on backorder for awhile because they were being replaced so often.

Britt

I tried to clean EGR but it didn't last long for me and finally I have CEL code P0401 (insufficient EGR flow),
also, another forum member imjustagirl told me EGR valve is covered under emission warranty too, but when I asked service he said it was covered under normal warranty. can anyone confirm this? or should I call mazdausa?
btw, nice write-up, what would I do without this forum? (thumb)

[wizteknet]

Well I was afraid I'd mess up a screw up, but decided to just use chanel locks, but it seems I was fortunate and my egr must have been cleaned previously before I bought it. Bought the 1999 1.6L ATX for a good price, with nice rims hope to have a sig pic shortly. Anyways did a tuneup & did the egr cleaning she feels new, considering 96k miles. What I love is the gas mileage before the egr cleaning, cant wait to see the improvement more... 1/4 inch socket wrench with 12mm socket was pretty easy for me, but I do have smaller hands, lefty loosen righty tighty, like previously said...

[122 Vega]

Glad this is working out for most of you guys. I seem to need to do mine again already, 32,000 miles now, and no racing this year just six round trips a week to the hospital for work which is only about eight miles each way. I plan on doing mine again when I put in a downpipe.

Britt

[Diehonda]

what type of oil should I use on the spring? I can verify that White Lithium is a no go. Seems to create the problem. I previously had a low idle, about 550. So I cleaned the egr and now I have an irratic idle which gets worse after warm up. Any recommendations?

[Diehonda]

not white lithium grease. it dries out and will lock it up. I used lock lubricant and all is better now.

[MrDiggler]

Just got through doing mine. I might not easily notice the difference b/c I'm swapping the tranny/flywheel/clutch along with a Turbohoses SMIC and Vibrant exhaust. The EGR was a b**ch to remove because of the bolt location. I ended up using the Dremel to cut 1/4" off of a 12mm socket. That made all the difference. Thanks for the how-to though!

[TunerzEdge]

Subcribing

[martinmzfan]

Just thought I'd lend my 2 cents. Thanks to ALL you guys for helping me resolve and repair my rough/rolling/dipping idle issue!! Here was my problem:

1) Rough standstill idle -- needle hovered up/down 50 RPM from 700
2) Occasionally wanted to stall after a warm start -- RPM dipped to 500
3) Poor fuel economy -- about low 20's
4) No DTCs -- wheww!
5) Engine vibrates/shakes

I performed the following operations:

1) Changed air-filter (ash inside from recent fires)

2) Changed spark plugs w/NGK V-power; old ones were Bosch Pt and were slightly burned at the tips and overheated at the plug boot part (orange ring).

3) Removed, cleaned, lubed and re-installed the EGR valve assembly:

a. this was a serious PAIN to perform! From under the jacked car (on stands), I used three drivers: 3/8" 90 deg swivle socket wrench, 1/4" flex "T" 90 deg socket wrench and 12mm offset boxed hand wrench. It wasn't on too tight. Found it was definitely full of carbon but operating within specs. Used Liquidwrench for the 4 screws. I checked resistance and plunger operation -- all okay. I used SeaFoam Deep Creep and blasted that puppy. Everything was cleaned. Some carbon remained on plunger but freely operated. I pre-installed the bolts & gasket on the assembly and placed blue painters tape over the bolts to hold 'em while squeezing everything back on the manifold.

4) Removed and cleaned IAC solenoid assembly plunger and mounting area on IAC core. Used T-25 tamper-proof screw bit from Craftsman. Piece of cake to do -- used Liquidwrench on the two screws to make life easier. Lots o' carbon on solenoid plunger and mounting area. Plunger sticking to IAC mount. Used SeaFoam Deep Creep to clean.

5) SeaFoam motor treatment through PCV system into intake to remove carbon build-up; used 6 oz. The trick is to have a second person maintain a fast idle while the solvent is slowly sucked through and cut engine.

6) inspected many other parts and found no faults (e.g., PCV, purge control, PS pump, plug wires, vac leaks... I was up until 1:30AM one night! Reset PCM.

Startup and Roadtest: Very close to being a new engine! The motor vibrates some -- good for 67K miles -- but is noticeably smoother. RPM is very stable and so far no unexpected dips. Passed all load tests.

UPDATE: I added a SeaFoam motor treatment to the list and engine has become very smooth. Successful repair cost under $100 including two new tools in my garage arsenal for future sagas!

[Ben@Toeldo]

I just finished my EGR cleaning and it was not even close to a 30 min job. I have Idle problems that cause my RPM's to dip erraticaly when I stop after highway drving. I did the EGR cleaning in hopes to rip myself of the idle problem.

The EGR cleaning did not solve my idle issue though I did notice the engine was running distinctly better. Tomorow I am going to change out spake plugs to IK-22's and also do an Idle Silinoid cleaning. I will post my results.

Some helpful hints:

- Remove anything in your way. Strut sway bar and battery removal will help to gain enough hand room to get the job done.

- PB Blaster is your friend. Plan on presoaking any visible bolt at least 1 hour before starting into the project.

- One of the 12mm bolts holding the EGR in place has very little clearance room to get a conventional sized ratchet onto the bolt. Use the smallest rachet you can find, preferably with swivel head action.

- Once you remove the EGR empty a large amount PB Blaster into a small dish and soak the EGR's 4 screws for at least an hour. If you do not use a penetrant of some kind you will most certainly destroy the 4 screw heads (they are extremely soft). Some patience with the penetrant will make this project extremely easy.

*update*

Today I tackled the 2nd part of the project, IAC silinoid cleaning and new spark plugs.

I bought the expensive IK-22 which I hear are a good match for any unichip users. The old plugs were some junko Champion coppers which looked aged which came out easily. I put anti-sieze compound on the new plugs and installed them quickly.

Last night I pre-sprayed the no-tamper screws that hold the IAC in place with PB Blaster penetrant. I picked up a T-25 no-tamper bit today at Autozone. The 2 screws removed with ease, thank you PB Blaster. Be careful not to lose the O'ring gasket that is in between the IAC and the manifold.

Once removed, the IAC didn't look too bad at first glance. I thuroughly cleaned all the mechanicle pieces with carb cleaner, then lubed them using dura-lube. Popped it back in place with ease.

I reset the ECU, started her up and let her idle for a bit.

Test Drive proved to be a Success. Idle problem was gone. She pulls much harder and all around performance fealt great. Now that she's running well I could actually feel the clutch slip in 3rd while WOT. My idle problems were most rough after highway driving. Seems the idle problems are completely gone.

EGR cleaning, IAC cleaning, and new sparkplugs were a god send to my car. Good luck!

[Pmpkinhead]

I'm at 32K and it started getting rough after 30K. This is the first I've seen of this thread. I will do both mods and post the results. THANK ALL OF YOU!!!!!

[speedprotegewi]

almost 44k and just did this today. did plugs and flashed ecu recently and there was still an ever slight sputter and this fixed it right up - great how to:!! the only thing i had a problem with was removing the stupid plastic pipe going into the throttle body, but a heatgun fixed that. i also recommend cleaning out your throttle plate while its off, mine was fairly dirty

[protegeric]

I cleaned my EGR and my car is still running rough also. What have you done about yours?

I just finished my EGR cleaning and it was not even close to a 30 min job. I have Idle problems that cause my RPM's to dip erraticaly when I stop after highway drving. I did the EGR cleaning in hopes to rip myself of the idle problem.

The EGR cleaning did not solve my idle issue though I did notice the engine was running distinctly better. Tomorow I am going to change out spake plugs to IK-22's and also do an Idle Silinoid cleaning. I will post my results.

Some helpful hints:

- Remove anything in your way. Strut sway bar and battery removal will help to gain enough hand room to get the job done.

- PB Blaster is your friend. Plan on presoaking any visible bolt at least 1 hour before starting into the project.

- One of the 12mm bolts holding the EGR in place has very little clearance room to get a conventional sized ratchet onto the bolt. Use the smallest rachet you can find, preferably with swivel head action.

- Once you remove the EGR empty a large amount PB Blaster into a small dish and soak the EGR's 4 screws for at least an hour. If you do not use a penetrant of some kind you will most certainly destroy the 4 screw heads (they are extremely soft). Some patience with the penetrant will make this project extremely easy.

[Kansei]

I cleaned my EGR and my car is still running rough also. What have you done about yours?

And you're sure the gasket is back in place properly and all the screws are torqued down enough? Mine got rougher after doing the EGR cleaning, but probably because I didn't even think their was a gasket, I think it was stuck on the intake manifold or something.

[protegeric]

The gasket stayed on the manifold I guess, thanks for this little hint. The bolts and screws are down tight enough though, so I HOPE and I`m GUESSING that is OK. Hmm, you think buying a crystal ball would be a good investment?

And you're sure the gasket is back in place properly and all the screws are torqued down enough? Mine got rougher after doing the EGR cleaning, but probably because I didn't even think their was a gasket, I think it was stuck on the intake manifold or something.

[Kansei]

The gasket stayed on the manifold I guess, thanks for this little hint. The bolts and screws are down tight enough though, so I HOPE and I`m GUESSING that is OK. Hmm, you think buying a crystal ball would be a good investment?

What did you use to clean it. I used intake manifold cleaner (supposedly really strong stuff) and it was fine after that. I also cleaned up the gasket and the underside of the intake manifold where it mates before putting it all back together.

[Ben@Toeldo]

I cleaned my EGR and my car is still running rough also. What have you done about yours?

See my edits above. I updated my post.

[protegeric]

Ah, I ONLY cleaned the EGR valve. I used some good stuff, B-12 Chemtool.

What did you use to clean it. I used intake manifold cleaner (supposedly really strong stuff) and it was fine after that. I also cleaned up the gasket and the underside of the intake manifold where it mates before putting it all back together.

[protegeric]

Sweet. That sounds like my problem. I`ll do what you did, I already have some good plugs though. I`ll try what you said about the IAC. I even have a spare 929 IAC. Maybe that one will work? I`ll just go ahead and do what you explained to mine. Thanks doods...

See my edits above. I updated my post.

[pfive]

i need to have my EGR cleaned, but i am not the best under the hood. Would the stealership do it?

[Kansei]

i need to have my EGR cleaned, but i am not the best under the hood. Would the stealership do it?

I'm sure they would for some $$. If they tried to charge for more than an hour of labor or for any parts bitch at them though, it's really not a time consuming job if you know what you're doing.

[pfive]

just replacing my spark plugs - i dropped 2 tools down into the engine area and had to fish them out with screw drivers...im hesitant..also, my hands are huge. ill call around on it. ihave a mechanic friend, but he is real busy.

[RaiderMP5]

I would recommend if you really are not that good with working on cars, get a friend who can to help. Ifnot, go to a good shop, other than the dealer. They are all evil.

[Kansei]

just replacing my spark plugs - i dropped 2 tools down into the engine area and had to fish them out with screw drivers...im hesitant..also, my hands are huge. ill call around on it. ihave a mechanic friend, but he is real busy.

Where in NY are you? Maybe there's a member on here who can help you do it.

[pfive]

Putnam County - just north of NYC.

[protegeric]

I`ll help you, drive to San Antonio. Woo! Meet on Fri. 21st

Putnam County - just north of NYC.

[pfive]

ok - let me clear it with my wife...when she gives me "the look" like "hell no" ill have you call her...hehehehe.

[chiefmg]

If you drop tools into your engine bay, get a mechanic's magnet. Basically it's a long rod (usually extendable) with a strong magnet on the end. If you can see what you dropped, you can retrieve it.

[vyse12012]

You sure you got a good seal on the two halves? And between the EGR and the manifold? You still have the little metal gasket inbetween the EGR and manifold?

is it bad if I didn't put that thing back ? I think it felt when I removed the EGR valve and I didn't think it was needed to put it back ..

[RaiderMP5]

It will most likely leak.

[vyse12012]

well I think I lost that metal gasket thing ...

any workaround for it ?

[Diehonda]

without sounding like an as. yeah, go buy a new one. Autozone should hav them or go to the dealer and pay a dollar or two.

[RaiderMP5]

i agree. It is a little gasket. The amount of time and work to rig something up is just too much effort.

without sounding like an as. yeah, go buy a new one. Autozone should hav them or go to the dealer and pay a dollar or two.

[vyse12012]

I just checked the maintenance PDF at protege5.ugly and I know what you mean now ... it must be somewhat important ..

I'm gonna try to get a net one thanks guy !

[protegeric]

Anyone know what bit is needed for taking off the IAC? It`s a special little torx or something odd.

[RaiderMP5]

The last guy who just took it apart, had to replace it.

[protegeric]

Well, I don`t wanna break anything and be stuck. BUT, my car still dies when it`s hot. Let`s say I turn it off to get gas or just turn it off for a short amount of time after it`s been driven. I start it back up and it will die if I don`t keep my foot on the gas pedal. It will stop dying after I drive a short distance though. Or sometimes when I get on it then put it in neutral it will die. I am almost 100% positive I do not have a vacuum leak, I checked. Hmm... cleaning the IAC sounded like a good idea from a previous post in this thread.

The last guy who just took it apart, had to replace it.

[Hughes412]

Ok I'm no knob when it comes to cars but I can't seen to figure out what IAC means.(poke)

[protegeric]

Idle Air Controller
You`re no knob, huh? ha, knob...

Ok I'm no knob when it comes to cars but I can't seen to figure out what IAC means.(poke)

[jflo]

i cleaned out my EGR valve finally after planning to do this for over a year (well, flypinoy7 did) and it solved my CEL...we had to cut the screw to give it a flathead slat to take it apart, but it worked, and now i don't have a CEL and my car idles a lot better. thanks 122 vega for putting this up ! i think this is a highly recommended how-to to do because if you're having idle problems and such, this will definitely help

[protegeric]

Well, definitely help unless you`re having whatever problem I`m having. AHH! Anyway, you have jflo gauges, jflo?

i cleaned out my EGR valve finally after planning to do this for over a year (well, flypinoy7 did) and it solved my CEL...we had to cut the screw to give it a flathead slat to take it apart, but it worked, and now i don't have a CEL and my car idles a lot better. thanks 122 vega for putting this up ! i think this is a highly recommended how-to to do because if you're having idle problems and such, this will definitely help

[jflo]

Well, definitely help unless you`re having whatever problem I`m having. AHH! Anyway, you have jflo gauges, jflo?

huh ? i know not of the gauges you speak. are they a kind of brand or something ?

and not too sure about the problem you're having. maybe the IAC is sensing a lot of hot air and telling the ECU to richen up the AFR ?

[pfive]

Well, I don`t wanna break anything and be stuck. BUT, my car still dies when it`s hot. Let`s say I turn it off to get gas or just turn it off for a short amount of time after it`s been driven. I start it back up and it will die if I don`t keep my foot on the gas pedal. It will stop dying after I drive a short distance though. Or sometimes when I get on it then put it in neutral it will die. I am almost 100% positive I do not have a vacuum leak, I checked. Hmm... cleaning the IAC sounded like a good idea from a previous post in this thread.

i have a similar issue. when my p5 is driving for a while, turned off then turned on 10 minutes lates, it will idle real low then come back up...its sporatic, but since i bought it used with 51K, i think it needs a little TLC under the hood. i purchased a bumper 2 bumper warranty to everything is covered...ill take it under under the 'low idle' factor.

[98b/w pro]

I did it in 27 min.
I acount it on my little girl hands and removing the throtle body. that gave me an ass load of room.

[RaiderMP5]

Taking the throttle body out probably cut the most time. In retrospect, I think taking out the battery will also really help too.

[Hughes412]

I did it, but it didn't help at all. I can't see how anyone really cleaned it. It may be just me. How and what did you all use to clean it. If you can't clean out the crud around the niddle and open the air way then just cleaning the main holes wont do much. Or maybe mine wasn't as bad as the others. Any ways let me know.

[novAKs47]

I did it, but it didn't help at all. I can't see how anyone really cleaned it. It may be just me. How and what did you all use to clean it. If you can't clean out the crud around the niddle and open the air way then just cleaning the main holes wont do much. Or maybe mine wasn't as bad as the others. Any ways let me know.

I just used some brake cleaner and a wire(not steel) brush. I may have used some carb cleaner too, I can't remember. I say use carb cleaner. lol Do an initial flush of the whole thing, then let whatever you end up using to clean it soak for a while. Then rinse it out and repeat. I didn't get all the crud out, and I noticed a difference.

[Diehonda]

3 in One Industrial Degreaser or Seafoam Deep Creep.

[PakmanMP5]

What is PCM?

[protegeric]

yeah, I`ve seen jflo brand gauges on the net somewhere. Well, this problem is really pissin` me off now. If there is an IAC problem, it sounds like I shouldn`t take it apart probably. Any other ideas or solutions? Or should I take the IAC off? OR, would this be covered under warranty? I`m not sure the dealer would do it for me, but they might if it`s legitimately covered. I have warranty left.

huh ? i know not of the gauges you speak. are they a kind of brand or something ?

and not too sure about the problem you're having. maybe the IAC is sensing a lot of hot air and telling the ECU to richen up the AFR ?

[martinmzfan]

I removed the IAC electrical solenoid assembly from the IAC core last month and inspected it. The IAC solenoid plunger was literally sticking in carbon buildup on the IAC mount. The (2) T-25 Tamper-proof screws were easy to remove after spraying with DeepCreep. Cleaned the solenoid plunger and mount. My idle smoothened up and COMPLETELY solved my sudden RPM dips (near stalls) on hot re-starts. Total time = 20 minutes; knuckles skinned = zero; dealer may charge you as a "package" deal to clean intake system or other BS PM treatment (overcharge city).

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1797962&postcount=97
(Thanks Kasmankk!!)

You do not need to remove the IAC valve from the intake -- only solenoid assembly!

[RaiderMP5]

Someone else took the IAC appart, and were unable to get it back together. Was there any specific steps you took to complete that?

[98b/w pro]

I dont couldnt even find a damn tool to take the damn thing apart. bastards at auto zone looked at me craizer than usual.

[RaiderMP5]

Yeah, most auto parts places get glossy-eyed when you mention that is it not american. The reverse happens in CA.

[GBean]

So I got thsi whole thing done in 20 minutes not including soak time in the carb cleaner. I also cleaned the oil out of the bottom of my air cleaner box. (K&N oil not dry when I put it in.) Also cleaned the throttle body.
Now it idles a ton more smooth. Acceleration is better too. Cant wait to see what it does to mileage.
Now for that big brake kit....

[Tasty]

I got a random CEL today at start up. Car has been dipping low when idling at lights sometimes. I wonder if this would take care of it? Worth a try I suppose.

[Hughes412]

Well, I do have to say that the car has ran better sence I cleaned it. Thanks for the write up.

[Diehonda]

I got a random CEL today at start up. Car has been dipping low when idling at lights sometimes. I wonder if this would take care of it? Worth a try I suppose.


I have read several times that the idle should be around 700. I have cleaned the egr and done a bunch of other stuff yet at a light after sitting for about thirty seconds, my idle dips to about 550 and stays there.

Very strange, yet no other problems. I haven't really looked into it too much but a honda tech asked me something about an idle regulator that has a fabric filter. ?? Eh, Not a big deal really. My gas mileage is awesome and I have no loss of power.

[02PROTEGE2.0]

me and a friend did this to myc car today... huge. ive got 80,000 on my 02 LX so this little clean amde a big difference....

[protegeric]

if cleaning the EGR doesnt not work, clean the IAC. It`s REALLY easy to do, easier than doin` the EGR. 2 T-25 tamper proof screws and pull it off. Be careful and pay attention when pulling it off, because it can slip out and fall (which isn`t a real big deal, u just have to find it). no real worry of breaking anything. EASY to clean with carb & choke cleaner, don`t get any lube or anything on the plunger cause I did and had to take it all back off and clean the plunger. u dont even need any lube really. super easy to do, just watch and try not to drop/lose anything.

[RBD402]

this is very helpfull.. thanks!

[2003newlyack]

I'm gonna be doing mine probably sometime tomorrow, hope it goes well!

[RBD402]

well i guess i have to clen them both.. IAC and EGR. my car has 70,000 already..

[Maxx Mazda]

I totally had the same problem! I used the ratchet from Sears that was not as thick as a regular ratchet, plus it had a swivel head, helped give me the .000005 of an inch needed to get torque on the nuts. I had to basically pop them loose with a ratchet, and use my fingers to remove them. If you have a magnetic parts tray, I suggest putting it under the EGR when removing them, as it is a pain to reach them if they fall down back there.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000

Founbd out it was my IAC valve that was dirty and stuck, not my EGR. Cleaned it up, and runs liek a dream now!

[beetlecat]

I don't know if another 'me-too' post is necessary but I'm gonna...

I've got around 75,000 miles on my '02 P5 and have been religious with it's maintenance. Then out of the blue one day the thing started idling rough and would barely keep running at idle. I found this thread and proceeded on doing the egr cleaning. So far, so good, that seems to have been the problem.

I do have to say, it was NOT a 30 min. job for me. Every bolt and screw under my car's hood is corroded and siezed. For the first four years of it's life it was on MI roads so maybe all the road salt in winter has something to do with that.
Anyway, it was a real pain to actually get the egr apart. Those screws just didn't want to come out. Ended up having to drill em out and replace em. At least next time, it 'should' be a thirty minute job. ;-)

Thanks for the How-to!

[protegeric]

i know the heads of the screws are weak. to anyone having trouble taking the screws out and stripping the heads... simply use some pliers, grab the head and do it that way. easy squeezy.

I don't know if another 'me-too' post is necessary but I'm gonna...

I've got around 75,000 miles on my '02 P5 and have been religious with it's maintenance. Then out of the blue one day the thing started idling rough and would barely keep running at idle. I found this thread and proceeded on doing the egr cleaning. So far, so good, that seems to have been the problem.

I do have to say, it was NOT a 30 min. job for me. Every bolt and screw under my car's hood is corroded and siezed. For the first four years of it's life it was on MI roads so maybe all the road salt in winter has something to do with that.
Anyway, it was a real pain to actually get the egr apart. Those screws just didn't want to come out. Ended up having to drill em out and replace em. At least next time, it 'should' be a thirty minute job. ;-)

Thanks for the How-to!

[Skoozul]

Well I did this mod and I found the a small 1/4 wrench with a 12mm socket fit quite nicely but it was an awkward angle. My car ran awesome but then I ended taking a very mean mountain road uphill and by the end the car started running like S#*T again. So once again I'll clean it, and see if it helps a second time.

[jsahyoun]

I wonder if this is my problem. My car is hard to start up without giving it gas. And it does not want to idle at all. If i leave it alone it sounds like it is severly sputtering or wheezing. ANy ideas??

[jflo]

following up on this how-to...when i fixed it in...april, it was fine for 150 miles, but after that it went bad again and threw the same CEL. i guess i'll have to go back and take it apart again. crap

[Hughes412]

following up on this how-to...when i fixed it in...april, it was fine for 150 miles, but after that it went bad again and threw the same CEL. i guess i'll have to go back and take it apart again. crap


yep me too. It has started to idol ruff again. But the good thing is it didn't take but 15-20 mins to do.

[ZoomThis]

Thanks for the posting.....helped me out:)

[Protege52003]

Thanks for the posting.....helped me out:)

you got yourself in trouble when you said that your EGR valve has not giving you trouble when I told you that I had to clean mine a couple weeks ago (for the secind time)........

-R

[ZoomThis]

you got yourself in trouble when you said that your EGR valve has not giving you trouble when I told you that I had to clean mine a couple weeks ago (for the secind time)........

-R

Yep, you Jinx me. I blame the bad New England gas....never had a problem in Wisconsin:)

[jmv]

heh, i had someone who had done it before help me and it took a long time. Mostly from accidentally dropping the bolts and having to find them though. We also did another MSP at the same time, and had to have 2 guys grab the block and pull it forwards in order to fit in the ratchet, whereas mine gave us no problems (once we were able to find the bolt heads straight on). We stripped out one of my screws, but some vice-grips took care of that easy.

[dasayheykid]

Thank you Thank you Thank you...This post has saved me $450 CDN...this worked like a charm!

Thank you for putting this up.